Mark C's Russian Mig-3 build

[midnightdreamersr]

well i finished my other build so its time to start the next one. i will be building a friends 1/4 scale russian mid-3 warbird. this will be my first giant scale warbird build so i would like all the inside help i can get. if you have any ideas, techniques or build secrets im all ears. i have build alot of planes before this one from giant scale aerobatic and a couple top flite warbirds. i have 2 zirolis that i will build hopefully within the next year or so, but this one will be the first one out. i have a couple additions to the build that should prove to be fun. 1. i am asked to built it so that the outter wing panels will be able to be removed for transport. 2. add retractable landing gear to the build. both ideas are not incorporated into the plans. i have the shop cleaned up and should be able to start laying up some parts after i go through the box of cut parts and find the ones that i will start with. i figure i will start with the horizonal and vertical stabs first. then move to the fuse or wing depending on what i feel like i want to do next. stay tuned for the start and pics to follow. thanks for looking and the help in advance.

[3ddd]

wht mig plans are you useing.a few years back i built the romoin research mig 3 still have it aqnd never flew it,it is huge but only weighs in at 36 pounds

[midnightdreamersr]

wht mig plans are you useing.a few years back i built the romoin research mig 3 still have it aqnd never flew it,it is huge but only weighs in at 36 pounds

i will have to look at the plans again when i get home, but that sounds about right. im going to try to lighten it up a bit if i can, if i see anywhere that i can take some wood out. these plans were drawn forever and a day ago, way before anyone thought about light planes.

[jaguar bone]

wht mig plans are you useing.a few years back i built the romoin research mig 3 still have it aqnd never flew it,it is huge but only weighs in at 36 pounds

Cheers Matt to the beginnings!!

3dd! What great news to learn you have built from the Roamin' Research plans! Have pictures of your project? Any major Oh Ohhhh's Matt should know about "up front"?
Curious why you never flew it?
At 36# finished weight I might need to consider using an engine displacement larger than a 50 cc? Would you recommend bolting a engine on with the added weight of a magneto for CG?

Roamin Research are the plans Matt has to work from. I purchased a cut kit from PRECISION CUT KITS. Can only recommend their first class service! :198:
www.precisioncutkits.com


This is a good build for for the real thing:
http://www.airforce.ru/aircraft/mikoyan/mig-3/rusavia/index.htm


Here is a picture of this Bad Boy fighter from the other hood that Matt is Building!

[3ddd]

thats the one.i didn't fly mine because i lost interest,i had a 3w 60 in the front of mine and had to make the cowl longer in all with a moterbox my fault i built it long as per plans haha.really you might use foam ribs outside of the gear mounts and really if i remember right ther is not alot to cut out. mine came out light i thought for this size airplane as it is huge for 25% more like a 39% the only pictures i have are on rcu under the title mig3 update.i will be glad to help all i can just drop me a line

[midnightdreamersr]

mark at 36lbs might be a good canadate for the new DA85! that should pull it around nicely. will start getting parts orginized later tonight.

[midnightdreamersr]

well not alot done but its a start. located all the pieces for the stabs and getting ready to start glueing together. heres a pic

[3ddd]

be very glad all those little ribs are cut for you, i cut all the kit myself and that was a job.the 85 willo be a hard squeeze into this plane as the cowl is very nerrow and almost nothing stays hidden.the exhaust problems are the main reason i parked mine.if it wasn't for the size i would sell mine but it is way too big to ship/i did sliding canopy and all panel lines to scale,off and on it took 9 years to build,wish i had pictures for you it really came out beutiful for a warbird

[3ddd]

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/showthread.php?t=47195 this is a real mig 3 in russia i have more but can't find them yet

[3ddd]

http://vvs.hobbyvista.com/ModelArticles/Massimo/colors.html#greenblack color schemes and mine

[midnightdreamersr]

yes ive very glad that all the parts are cut out for me. the begining of the year i finished a 50% pitts that i had to cut out everything for and it took forever and was not too fun. i cant blow up your pics to look at your plane but what i can see, wow man it looks awsome! what method did you use to finish yours, fiberglassed the whole thing and paint or what? did you biuld it to the plans or modify anything?

[jaguar bone]

Ron, I too know how one can lose interest. Kenn & I have 96"w.s. Hawker Hurricanes stowed up high after cutting out two complete kits - loosing our building area and a divorce move didn't help either! :197: That was some serious "kit cutting" from flat stock! One former (at turtledeck) had 72 rib notches in it! That's a lot of lumber headed toward the tail!

Did your plane ever maiden? :195: Still around?

Did you build yours with the fixed gear or modify for retracts?

Our plans are to build the wing in three pieces. There is question wether there is any dihedral in the outer wing panels and the stab? Do you recall?

[3ddd]

well i stayed with the straifgt plans as i wanted something to go fly without working on it.i never maidened it but i do still have it.the finish is 1/2 oz cloth .put two coats laqure sanding sealer then use brushing lauqure to put the cloth on,it takes about 6 coats to fill the weave but over 80% evaporates out and weighs nothing.the paint is byer outdoor latex enamal then cleared with minwax polycrylic not polyurathan

[midnightdreamersr]

mark i found the dihedral on the plans, problem solved. thats why i never posted the questions.

thanks

[midnightdreamersr]

well i ran into a couple missing parts from the kit while laying out the parts for the stabs, so i went through the whole thing. i supplied mark the list to get with PCK to get them to me. will pick back up on the build after i wrap up a few things.

[midnightdreamersr]

well i got some sticks glued together tonight. the stab is taking shape. im sorta glad that i started here, but if the rest of the kit goes like this i will be drivin to drink. im sure that it will get better as the rest of the pieces seem to fit better than the stab ones did. im sure it will all work out in the long run. this is like i said my first war bird build on this scale so i know im in for some surprises and some more work to get it done. anyway here is a pic.

[3ddd]

i hate to ask this but how many kits have you built? this is not a plane for the faint of heart builder.the fuse is a real bear to sheet.it has many real hard compound curves and the wing fillets are a bear and a half.i don't mean to scare you off but be ready to pull some hair.you can pm me anytime you need to.

[jaguar bone]

YiKEs!!:195:
Bumpy start eh Matt?!

No word back yet from PCK. I will call Thursday if no word by them -in the mean time, I'll re-send the e mail with the list and query on same just in case.

[vatechguy3]

have you thought about using an 80cc inline or 100cc inline engine? one of these should be narrow enough to fit the cowl.

tony

[midnightdreamersr]

i hate to ask this but how many kits have you built? this is not a plane for the faint of heart builder.the fuse is a real bear to sheet.it has many real hard compound curves and the wing fillets are a bear and a half.i don't mean to scare you off but be ready to pull some hair.you can pm me anytime you need to.

i have build alot of kits, including a couple scatch built kits which also was a bit challanging. not saying i cant do it, im just use to building 35 and 40% aerobats that build alot easyier and the parts fit alot better to start. i will pm you if i have any questions but i will build this kit even if im hairless when im done. i enjoy building plans and i love a challenge, looks like i get both with the build so far. lets not forget too, its only the first piece of many to come and im sure it will get better. thanks for all the imput and thanks for watching. this will be fun and eduactional to say the least. will start the elev tonight, well see how that goes.

[jaguar bone]

have you thought about using an 80cc inline or 100cc inline engine? one of these should be narrow enough to fit the cowl.

tony

Thanks vatechguy3 for chiming in!
I have not considered any in line options.
Do you have any one on one exposure to any particular model? I'm open to any suggestions - especially those based on experience. I recall there is a company in Canada - (of course the name eludes my memory) that ran an in-line 4 cyl in a Mustang that was truly a champ of a performer. Sounded truly cool too.:D

Unfortunately I no longer have the convenience of the actual drawings, but I believe a 80cc will cowl width ways with no problem. It appears the overall height is the primary issue. In-line arrangement could allow for a shorter OA height.
Please list your suggestions and links! :198:

[jaguar bone]

Frankly I believe completely cowling the engine is dang near a lost cause. :199:
The spinner will be 5" diameter -you judge for yourself.
Lets see your suggestions if you have any guys!

[3ddd]

fiberglass specialities has the cowl and canopy for this in stock by the way

[midnightdreamersr]

yes, we already have all the fiberglass parts for the plane. the only way to hide a motor is to go electric. better be willing to shell out big money for that. my two cents, put a da 85 and let it all hang out. your not going to see it going by at 100mph. paint the bottom of the plane grey and it wont stand out that bad. my oppinion.

[midnightdreamersr]

well got alot more sticks glued together tonight. got both elev halves build up, the vertical stab and the rudder. i have to add the filler blocks and sheet everything to be complete, but done for a bit. here are a couple pics.

3ddd,

did you sheet the stabs and everything then glue on the balsa blocks and shape them, or did you shape the balsa blocks then sheet over everything. im thinking the right way would be the first one, but thought id ask you since youve built one. how did you do it? thanks

[3ddd]

i sheeted the parts then put the blocks on and shaped them to it

[jaguar bone]

I'm going to check later today but now I'm thinking going wide (not long) may be the better option. A std. configured sideways twin- - the cowl has more width to use than height. That may be the answer and more engine options in that configuration.

[vatechguy3]

the inlines should work fine, you would just have to move the firewall back due to the extra length of the motor.

the only issue with running an inline motor is the cooling of the rear cylinder. you have to construct ducting to make sure you get enough airflow through the fins on the rear cylinder.

tony

[midnightdreamersr]

im hoping to start the fuse contruction next week, so we need to figure out what motor before i get the front formers/firewall glued in. it will be awhile before i make it to that point but the sooner the better.

[jaguar bone]

Hy Matt.
Been looking at different schemes and came up with this one. Here is a refurbished version close to same paint colors and scheme.

[midnightdreamersr]

that sould look good. is there a pic of the top of the wings and stabs.

[flying skunks]

Mark , you could run a Brisson Revolution 50 ..They are light ,narrower than a DA , and have a longer setback . I have one in a 27% Extra , swinging a 24x8 prop at 6500 no a stock muffler , it really has a ton of power ..I will show you next time I see you ..:198:

[jaguar bone]

Mark , you could run a Brisson Revolution 50 ..They are light ,narrower than a DA , and have a longer setback . I have one in a 27% Extra , swinging a 24x8 prop at 6500 no a stock muffler , it really has a ton of power ..I will show you next time I see you ..:198:

Thanks for the suggestion Donnie. Supposedly this plane will finish out around 30#. You still think a 50cc would be adequate? I'm not targeting a speed demon- just 'sum' reserve mo joe if ever needed. 30lbs seems a bit on the edge for a fiddy - ya think?.

Here is a picture of the pilot I plan to use. Will paint him a different colors of course. :197:

[3ddd]

you goin to be real hard pressed to get this bird in at less than 35 plusespecially if you use retracts and full pilots it will be closer to 40

[flying skunks]

at that weight , maybe a DA 85 ,T90 ?? :207: how about one of the inline 3W twins ?

[midnightdreamersr]

there is NOT enough room for an inline twin. we need a big single.

[flying skunks]

Matt , do you still have one of those Quadra 100's ?:202:

[midnightdreamersr]

Matt , do you still have one of those Quadra 100's ?:202:

yes i do have one still, i thought about it just havent said anything yet. it would always be an option.

[flying skunks]

yes i do have one still, i thought about it just havent said anything yet. it would always be an option.


that was my thought also ..

[jaguar bone]

you goin to be real hard pressed to get this bird in at less than 35 plusespecially if you use retracts and full pilots it will be closer to 40


3ddd, with the 3w 60 in the front, did you need to add weight fore or aft for proper CG?
I need to know if I can benefit from a magneto ignition. Thanks for your comments!

[jaguar bone]

that sould look good. is there a pic of the top of the wings and stabs.

Well the documentation on this fighter variant is sparse at best. I'll opt to fake it and go with what looks best since conflicting documentation is probably nonexistent. The only way around this is to go with a refurbished plane .

Looks like these colorized pics show a star on each upper (and lower) wing- nothing on stab. Most pictures I have (and that is quite a few!) go both ways - single star or nothing on the wing tops.

If any passive lookers know of a place I can get a custom spinner for this project, please post with a name ( link?) or PM me.
I'm resorting to a P-51 shape as a last resort. UGH!

[kamikaze89]

You should try checking out IL-2 Sturmovik (flight Simulator). They do some very nice modeling and have quite a few Mig-3 variants along with accurate schemes.

Here is a site with a few schemes.
http://zargos-skins.checksix-fr.com/nzsf-php-skin.php?SKIN_ID=129&ARMY=VVS (http://zargos-skins.checksix-fr.com/nzsf-php-skin.php?SKIN_ID=129&ARMY=VVS)
Good Luck!!

Chase

[3ddd]

i thing it balanceed with battery packs if i remember right.the spinner is a real prob i used the zinger as it is real light and almost the right size.i lengthened my cowl at the nose to make it fir the spinner perfect

[jaguar bone]

i thing it balanceed with battery packs if i remember right.the spinner is a real prob i used the zinger as it is real light and almost the right size.i lengthened my cowl at the nose to make it fir the spinner perfect

Thanks kamikaze89 for the link. I wonder where these guys get the documentation for creating the "models"?


3ddd -That is good news then - no added dead weight on the short side of the CG!
I believe the end of the cowl is at 5.25" so lengthening the cowl to taper at 5" would be a procedure to consider. Actually I might solicit some help from a friend who has a milling machine to make me a back piece similar to the picture for a stock 5" spinner. That back piece would most likely finish out at 5.25" and provide the mid-position prop placement similar to the full scale.

This Ralf Borchers creation is pretty nice - if he could get my e mail queries... :199:
Pretty nice lookin' eh?

[3ddd]

yes that is a sharp looking idea,and it is alot less work than blending in a cowl,let me tell ya

[jaguar bone]

Matt- I don't recall seeing near this much washout in the plans.
Shame 3dd - you never flew your bird! :212:
Wondering how well this design we are doing really does in the air :206:

[jaguar bone]

. :popcorncocktail::5a:

[midnightdreamersr]

well i got the rest of the parts that were missing today from PCK. i will be starting on the fuse soon and can finish up the stabs at the same time.

[jaguar bone]

:22::Banane34::bananajum:bananajum:Banane57:
Whoooo Whooooooo Matt!
Matt- Any way you can get the cowling in the next picture you post with a ruler laying across the open back end of it for reference?

Don't you have your live flying movie shoot this weekend? Looks like the weather is gonna be very cooperative! Would love to invite myself to be yo' pit biotch, but I will be at FOF Saturday for for sure.

[midnightdreamersr]

mark,
yes the weather is looking good for this weekend. as long as the wind is north south it will be the maiden for the ziroli SBD for the movie work that m working on. i will post some cowl pics if i remember tonight. trying to get another small project done before the weekend, and get the SBD ready.

[midnightdreamersr]

mark, here is the cowl pics that you asked for. if you need anything else let me know.

[jaguar bone]

mark, here is the cowl pics that you asked for. if you need anything else let me know.

ETA?? :D
Only kidding...

Thanks for the help Matt. I hate to sink big bucks in a power plant for a now and then flier, but I do want power plenty to haul the 32# beast off the ground and around. (Can't wait to confirm that stat! YiKEs! :201:)

[jaguar bone]

Well I picked up a ZDZ 80 today at the airfield so that issue is now resolved.
It came with a Bisson straight muffler which will probably need to change to a Pitts.

NOTE UPDATE!! !! Make that 6" from mount to thrust washer!

[midnightdreamersr]

mark,

well that should be plenty of power for this plane. thanks for including the measurements for the motor that will help when i get to the motor box are of the fuse.

well i got the fuse crutch started. i should be able to get it finished up tomorrow night, then will start assembling the formers on the crutch after that. again the plans dont match up to the actual parts. so im having to ad lib the crutch build. here is a pic what ive got so far.

3ddd,
did you build your crutch over the plane part of the plans or over where your supposed to build it over. neither one matches the cut out parts that i have. the parts match the templates though. just thought since youve built this youd have alittle incite for me, how you did it.

[jaguar bone]

Shame you can't change the thread name Matt to : Mark C's Russian Mig-3 Challenge Build. :206:

[3ddd]

i built it right over the plans,my parts matched perfect but you have to remember paper shrinks and expands alot do to different wheather cond. i cut my parts off the plans that i built it on so everything matched

[3ddd]

i warned you hahaha this is not an easy build at all.even for an exp builder--- and i hate to tell you this but you ain't even to the good stuff yet

[midnightdreamersr]

i warned you hahaha this is not an easy build at all.even for an exp builder--- and i hate to tell you this but you ain't even to the good stuff yet

3ddd,

i cant wait!! i will figure it out and i will finish this!! its a challenge now and i love a good challenge.

[jaguar bone]

i warned you hahaha this is not an easy build at all.even for an exp builder--- and i hate to tell you this but you ain't even to the good stuff yet

Chit! I sure hate to read this prediction!
Maybe you could save me and Matt a bunch of grief and tell us why your bird never went out for that maiden flight?

Matt - I gotta love ya man. You got conviction! :198:
Me - and I just sunk another chef salad wad of cash in this project.

Matt, I'm be pullin' for ya and keepin' my stick on the ice. :199:

[VooDoo Child]

Ohhhhhh this is gettin gooooood.