USRA Giant Scale race "THE VIDEO!"

[CRG]

As Robert says, perhaps you have had some bad experience in the past, but your comments absolutely do not apply to todays GSR scene. I would urge people to talk to those currently involved, or come and see a race in person before taking Mithrandir's comments to heart.

Ohio was my third race and I, like Robert and PFR, have received nothing but open arms and help from any and all. Absolutely one of the best modeling communities I've ever been around.

The Unlimiteds can be a handful on takeoff, torque is obviously what swings them left. In most cases there is ample room for them to get safely airborne in that manner. They just don't have sufficient control authority at slower speeds to hold them completely straight.

As far as overshooting the landing, these models glide a long way. It would seem simple enough to extend further downwind before turning final, but I think some of it is a comfort/visibility issue. It's probably easier for most to judge airspeed and attitude with the model closer to them, and thus make a better landing. The result of this is rolling long. At the runways we use going long is seldom an issue. There is an event supplied retrieval trailer, and usually an additional golf cart or two also.

Come on out and show us how it's done, new racers are always welcome.

Craig.

	Quote: Originally Posted by Mithrandir
	Here's the rest of the story... Many of the pilots have NO business flying such a dangerous plane. There is no "Certification" or means of taking a pilot from an entry level class and moving him up the ranks... There is no means of making sure a pilot has the skills and experiance to do this... they may say there are... but the skill level and the nuimber of close calls indicates otherwise... watch the video of the unlimiteds taking off... they barely get off the ground prior to running off the left edge of the runway.... They all overshoot the landings...Too many of these guys are hacks with a fat wallet!!! The politics of the genre is also horrible... (I have been out of it for a couple years... so maybe it has changed... but likely not)... I know someone who made molds of a P-51... (Strega I think) and after the molds were done, the rules changed making his molds obsolete.... Try to buy a prop... if you are "Somebody"... you can get the bad'est prop.. if you are not one of the boys... you wait! I apologize if I come off as being a cranky ol' ba$turd.... I only mention this because THIS is the facet of the sport that can change the paradigm of models being "Toys" verses models being a serious sport requiring skill and attention to details and seriousness... this is the genre that could get Modelers a little respect!!!! The opportunity is there...but I think the "Players" drop the ball!! I would only attend one of these races if I had a hard hat and upped my life insurance....

[Mithrandir]

WOW!!!!
Almost sounds like we are talking about 2 different things....
I was at the last race in Jean Nevada... (5 years ago maybe???) and the skill
level was scary....
I sincerely hope my assesment is dated and wrong....
(Though speaking with a recent participant at parker... my notions according to him are correct... )
Maybe I will pit/crew for my buddy again next year so I can see for myself....

really... I would LOVE to be wrong......

[GR-7 Driver]

Planes usually land dead stick for a couple of reasons. First, the airframes are very slippery and shutting down the engines allow for shorter landings and second, F1 and Unlimited props cost as much as $250.00. By killing the engines the props go horizontal keeping the prop safe in a nose over and also limiting bent cranks due to prop strikes. FYI... these props are readily available to whom ever needs them,fast or slow, rich or poor. Please make time to come out to Parker,Az the last weekend of October and see how much fun everybody is having!!

Scott Hanbury
Eastern Dist. Rep - USRA

[Temptation]

	Quote: Originally Posted by SleepyC
	Thanks. What sucks is.. I had a great camera, (Canon GL-2) and someone wanted it a bit more than I did, and it was stolen (FROM a FLYIN!!!). If I would have had that camera the footage would have been AMAZING. But the little Panasonic is still a 3CCD camera and takes clean video, only problem ....I have no sweet leneses for the little guy. But I think for the grayness of the sky... it turned out pretty good! Oh well... Max and gang can catch the last leg of the race and get some sunny footage!!

Sleepy, that hurts just hearing about it. At a flyin no less. That is unbelievalbe. I hope you are able to replace it someday.

As for the coverage....great. I am going to attend a GSR event as a spectator as soon as the oprutunity arises for me. I got to see the last day of pylon racing at the 2002 Nats and that was awesome. I don't think I have, or ever will have the skill needed to pilot one of those hot rods, but this is one facet of our sport that is very entertaining to watch, unlike those lawn darts I fly. Watching pattern is like watching paint dry, actually doing it is a differnt story, but we will never catch the attention of ESPN. How cool would it be to be flipping through the channels on a rainy day and find GSR on ESPN?

Mike Darr

[rcign]

Mithrandir...So you would LOVE to be wrong ? YOU ARE...
Skill level ? How about some clown buying a big TOC type airplane and hovering it 10 feet from the spectators...Is there a qualifying process to fly one of those, or just a pocketful of cash...
How about a kid flying his first park flyer in a public park ?
I'm one of the officials on the flight line, standing behind the hay bales during flights..If we thought someone couldn't handle the type of plane he was flying he would be told to land and come back when his skill improved...
It HAS happened...
ALL forms of racing are dangerous, be it planes, cars, Go Karts, bicycles, or anything else...We take steps to minimize the dangers, and have a record as good or better than any other sport....
No pilot I know of started out racing without years of sport flying....
Our youngest race pilot is too young to get a driver's license, the oldest is over 80...
I was at the first race at Madera, attended almost every race since, some as a spectator, some as an engine builder, some as an official...I KNOW what I'm talking about..ALL parts of the planes are inspected before the races..We have an enviable safety record, as good or better than any other type of airplane competition...
Come on out to Parker and see for yourself...

[Mithrandir]

	Quote: Originally Posted by rcign
	....... Mithrandir...So you would LOVE to be wrong ? ......

Really... I would..
I knew I would get a lot of heat over my remarks...
I coulda just posted nothing... and gone on my merry way...
I will state again... This could be the "NASCAR" of RC Modeling...
Why doesn't ESPN Cover this stuff...????
Way easier then covering Reno... lots more action...
I hate being the "Wet rag on the flames of Enjoyment" .......
I will make an effort to witness the spectacle of Giant Scale Racing again...
and If I am wrong.. I will be only to happy to say so.....

But if my feelings don't change.... I will come back here and say it like I saw it!!!!

(For the record... I have also seen a lot of these guys come out to Rabbit Dry lake to Practice..... It is SCARY!!!! They virtually NEED the whole lake bed to get it off and on the ground... so forgive me if I find it a little hard to believe that things have changed... But... I will have an open mind)

[Cobra1]

Question: Do these planes have a movable rudder? steerable tail wheel? I ask because for what they do - go fast, turn left - they really don't need either. Thanks. By the way, I will be attending one of these events next year. This is my kind of flying!!

[Biff]

Easy fellas! You guys are both right in that racers AND 3D planes have the potential for bad things. Statistically it's the .40 size plane that's the biggest problem. Having attended Rantoul last year, I can say the efforts the racing crowd go to in the name of safety is beyond what any other facet of RC is doing. Log books of every airplane, tethered motors, safety inspections, distance from flight line to spectators, Bill H. running the flight line, the list goes on and on. As far as pilot skill, I felt very safe at the event. I'm very impressed with the efforts that go into safety at races.

Mike and Craig are both well respected and experienced pilots. Let's slow it down boys. It's all about flying safley and respecting other forms of our hobby. It's all good!

Hey Mith, don't go watch,,GO RACE!!!!

[Mithrandir]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Biff
	........ Hey Mith, don't go watch,,GO RACE!!!!

Are you kidding... My little 40% SX has nearly BK'd me and my reflexes are way too slow!!! That is why I fly the big slow easy flying 3D planes...
Plus... I can't take the stress....... I would have to take some Valium after every flight just to calm down!!!
Leave it for the young guys!!!

[Tom_E]

Heck let me jump in here with some comments/answers.
As an unlimited and F1 stick, feel I have some insight

Deadstick/long landings:
The motors in these bad boys won't idle and with a 29 pitch prop on the front a 2500 rpm throttle down won't let you land, so we always shut them off. Secondly we are almost always out of fuel. I carry 80 oz for the 1:20 race and use it all.......
Given we fly at full size airports and have 3000 ft of runway plus, we usually have a whole bunch of adrenalin and are trying to get the airplanes on the ground quickly so the next heat can go don't try to put right in front of us on the landing. Like someone else said we have recovery vehicles so no big deal.

Comments here about the bad takeoffs.
You will notice that all the edge of runway takeoffs were AWAY from the pilot/spectator line and that is because we have a VERY hard safety line that will DNQ us if we cross. Someone else was right in that the torque of these big beasts coupled with any kind of gusty Xwind will most always bite you. I lost my unlimited at the Ohio race and it wasn't because I am a bad pilot; but if you aren't perfect every single time, just like any RC model, they will bite you, and it did!. This was my fourth season and over 100 flights on this airplane so if I was a weak pilot it wouldn't have lasted that long.

Skill level:
RC was right, the USRA has very strict safety rules and I have seen the flight line judges put more than one pilot on the ground for unsafe/unpredictable flying. We have pilots get DNQ'd for just "touching" the deadline - even if your in control. There have been a lot of very good pilots fly erractic from time to time, so you just need to get on the course to see for yourself how challenging this is. On flying ability, again RC is right, pilots will tend to start/move up to the class that they can handle. Skill level is very tough to define/judge - has every flight you had been "perfect"? Given that the flight line bosses do a commedable job in watching for pilots who consistently fly erratic/unsafe and are talked to and grounded if necessary.


Cobra1:
Yes we have rudders and steerable tailwheels; it is required in the rules.


I would invite anyone who wants to experience the thrill of what we do to stop by our tent and any of our team will answer all your questions and show you anything you want to see.

[Tailchaser]

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcign
Anybody here know Mike Stroup ? I heard he made some comments about my favorite sport, Giant Scale Racing...I would like to read the post to make appropriate comments...
Thanks, Ralph Cunningham, RC Ignition, Giant Scale racing engine inspector and flight line official..
Thanks in advance....


I wouldn't worry too much about Mikes comments, he said a few bad things about the war bird crowd also and got them all riled up. No matter what RC Group you fly with or follow we all should support each other, Heck I LOVE speed, and raced the little guys for fun, but you guys are in a league of your own and are an asset to the RC sport!
And welcome to our little corner of the RC world.

Chuck

[Toro]

MY 2 cents...

Safety is subjective, yet is objective based on statistics. Anything we do in the RC world next to RC cars has an element of danger. Whether it be hovering 2' in front of you TR'n next to your buddies as they are doing the same thing, or 3D'n a righteous chopper on the deck... It all has an element of danger... The world today has safetyd' itself into a scared little lamb. People these days are litigious, and will sue over a broken finger nail, hence all the safety stuff... The bottom line is be responsible for your own action, own up to your mistakes, and learn from them.

Like I said about being subjective... One guys level is so much different than another guys level, and because the more cautious, careful one is the most conservative, that is usually the route taken. We have become accustomed to following the "dumbed" down way of thinking, and arbitrarily call the unfamiliar unsafe or dangerous. This goes for everything in life. My job is a fireman, you think its unsafe, I think its perfectly safe. I think a police officers job is unsafe and crazy, they think the same about my job. I think if we take the time to really look at all the stats, pre-established policies, and procedures, and records we will see that most all of "OUR" activities are relatively safe. If you want to be totally safe, dont leave your house... Although, statistics say your more likely to die in your home from an accident, than get killed traumatically outside your house.

"safety never sleeps until I go to bed"

T