Does anyone make Aileron Spades for models?

[IMACmike]

Spades act like an aerodynamic counter balance. My father's Pitts Special had them and the amount of force required to deflect the control surface was reduced. Some spades had an adjustable linkage to assist in tuning them (as seen on the late Leo Loudenslager's Lazer 200).

[yakwrecker]

	Quote: Originally Posted by ryansmith
	I believe that most aerobatic airplanes have pushrod actuated control surfaces. The CAP 10B that I fly from time to time has pushrods on everything, even the rudder, which has a tiller arm that allows for cables to exit and connect to the rudder.

Ryan,
Im pretty sure that they use cable systems. I saw an Extra 330 at oshkosh with its skins off and it was all cable operated. I think like RC330 said that if they were infront of the hinge line it would act like the aerodynamic CB on the tail surfaces do. But think about it, if you fly a R/C plane that has CB's on the tail and then fly sonething like a 260 that doesnt have them on the elevators, do you notice any diffrence in how the plane acts, probly not, because there is so much power from the servo that it is almost impossible to tell the diffrence. And that also depends on how the planes are set up in comparision to each other.

[SargeNZ]

From just thinking it through you could conclude that spades help with both up and down deflection. I would assume that with the aileron neutral you want the spade with a 0 degree angle to the oncoming airflow? Then if the aileron deflects down, the spade is put in a positive angle to the airflow, making lift, since the spade is foward of the hingepoint, it helps the aileron rotate down.

When the aileron is deflected upwards, the spade is put into a negative angle, this causes a force downwards on the spade, helping to pull the aileron upwards.

Would it not also add to aileron surface area and thus roll authority?

NB: This is just what I have deduced, and could quite easily be wrong.

[rdgood]

Sarge,

in theory - it does sound plausible

May have to make a test wing or something?? Say maybe on one wing ??

Ronster

[jp300]

They help both up and down. If not, the two spades would somewhat off-set each other.

[yakwrecker]

	Quote: Originally Posted by SargeNZ
	From just thinking it through you could conclude that spades help with both up and down deflection. I would assume that with the aileron neutral you want the spade with a 0 degree angle to the oncoming airflow? Then if the aileron deflects down, the spade is put in a positive angle to the airflow, making lift, since the spade is foward of the hingepoint, it helps the aileron rotate down. When the aileron is deflected upwards, the spade is put into a negative angle, this causes a force downwards on the spade, helping to pull the aileron upwards. Would it not also add to aileron surface area and thus roll authority?

Them only authority gained from spades is a lighter stick for the pilot. they have no aerodynamical benfit as far as performance goes.

[airriley]

I would have to argue that in theory at least they would add the extra aerodynamic authority, especially on the aileron going up (possibly resulting in aileron differential). We may be talking .001 percent, something completely nominal, but it's theory. No doubt their greatest benefit is full scale aerobats without powered surfaces. But hey it may cause you to use 50 mah less out of your battery pack per flight.

[Matt Chapman]

Wow, this is a great topic. I ton to to go over. Lot's of misinformation already on the thread. It's going to take some time to sort through. I'll hope back on later and dive into it.
One thing I can't let go right now and that is...no cables in an Extra control system other than rudder. All modern acro mounts have push/pull rods. Solid. no slop.
Check back later for my full deal.

[yakwrecker]

My bad guys I apologize for the cable thing. I think we all need to shut up and let matt tell us whats up. I will be the first to shut my trap. I thought i had a pretty logical reason for what i said. My apologies to everyone. On thing that i must add is that we are comparing a foam and balsawood model to a high-tech wood and composite and aluminum full scale plane. Also comparing a human being to a couple servos to move the controls. there are a lot of variables in this conversation.

[GremlinX]

Great, Matt is here...

[Edge 540]

I think a spade would be "mostly" a mass balance of the surface. I have read that this can be tricky to setup, and too much can be a bad thing. (says Andy Lennon...)

[DKnippen]

Although I've never flown a plane with spades I feel this is something for each individual Full scale pilot to help them preform their maneuvers with the least amount of stress. I'm sure this is something they must do with every new plane they fly. Sort of like a personal trimming thing.Too much degree either way will result in too hard to push or too much pull on the pilot. What might work good for Matt Chapman would not work well for Svetlana Kapanina.
As for are servos it might work in the same manner. You could be putting more stress on the servos than assisting them. You would never know.
They do look cool though. Matt are you out there?