IMAC Points???

[Downhumpty]

I would love to hear what others have to say on this subject. Come on in guys, this is what FG's for... discussion and being able to agree to disagree. Let's get your views.

DH

[ifly3d]

	Quote: Originally Posted by bodywerks
	In order for it to count, it has to be made available for all IMAC competitors, at least for all SE IMAC competitors. That is not the case. It has become a national competition, with a pilot cap around 60.

dont really care one way or the other. I was just wondering, and I can see both sides of this.


As for the unknowns, I really dont care when we get them. In the morning the night before five minutes before we fly. I think this should be left up to the cd. It makes ever contest a little different, but all so fun. When I went to the JR challenge we had an unknown that all we new was the manuvers and five minutes before we had to fly they gave us the order they were to be flown in, That was one of the coolest unknowns that I have flown.

[Jim Woodward]

Guys,

I'm surprised how much passionate discussion there is on this topic. In my humble opinion, the very decision to cap the classes - thus making the contest "not available" to every South East pilot, in effect determined that it cannot be counted towards SE points. All other issues aside from inception till present, the prevailing factor is that it is not open to every South East pilot by design & intent of the primary sponsor. Not in a million years could this be counted for the South East points - should never have carried on this far.

IMHO.
Jim

[Al Lewis]

	Quote:
	As for the unknowns, I really don't care when we get them. In the morning the night before five minutes before we fly. I think this should be left up to the cd. It makes ever contest a little different, but all so fun. When I went to the JR challenge we had an unknown that all we new was the maneuvers and five minutes before we had to fly they gave us the order they were to be flown in, That was one of the coolest unknowns that I have flown.

Now this is where it starts. Purely innocent conjecture insinuating "Hey' it's more fun when they don't follow the rules." I realize this was not the intent of the statement but where it ends up is "Let's do unknowns in basic" Next thing you know no one has any points for the event. Don't shoot the messenger guys, it seems to be a widespread mindset.

[Jcarte]

Jim, It "was avalible" to everyone in the SE and other regions, I know some guys pulled of the road at a Taco Bell so they could access the internet at the time of registration. I can't find reference in the guildlines that states a contest cannot have a cap. Sorry Tony post #31 Amp's Aerobatics Challenge

I hate to thow this one out there but post #23
Clover Creek Aerodrome Invitational IMAC Contest

[Al Lewis]

	Quote:
	I can't find reference in the guildlines that states a contest cannot have a cap.

If the cap is reached and people can no longer register...it's NOT open to everyone!!!! DUH!!!

[Jim Woodward]

Hey Jeff,

Downhumpty asked for more discussion so I gave my opinion. When you cap the classes for a National/Invitational special event like this, I think this falls outside the realm of a typical local contest where a CD like Tony hints at a cap. We are all extremely lucky to be flying IMAC at the birth of this event, for the hard work many people are putting into it, which looks to capture much or more of what the TOC had while opening it up to us mortal pilots too. I'm just surprised the points is such an issue considering there are so many other contest we can go to that are not capped, especially for the South East.

I would have thought people would be more upset about the "National's" points not being counted, versus this Invitational/National-level/privately sponsored event.
Thanks,
Jim

[Al Lewis]

Jim I think it's really pretty simple. If it's an invitational or a capped event, the points should not count because every member was not allowed the chance to earn points. Mind you, I still think you should have to be an IMAC member to fly in an IMAC event so I'm probably certifiable! LOL Here's something for the powers to be to think about though....if it's a capped event and the cap is not reached i.e. 100 tops and only 75 sign up...maybe then the points should count. Members still had births to fill but chose not to.

[Jcarte]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Jim Woodward
	Hey Jeff, Downhumpty asked for more discussion so I gave my opinion. When you cap the classes for a National/Invitational special event like this, I think this falls outside the realm of a typical local contest where a CD like Tony hints at a cap. We are all extremely lucky to be flying IMAC at the birth of this event, for the hard work many people are putting into it, which looks to capture much or more of what the TOC had while opening it up to us mortal pilots too. I'm just surprised the points is such an issue considering there are so many other contest we can go to that are not capped, especially for the South East. I would have thought people would be more upset about the "National's" points not being counted, versus this Invitational/National-level/privately sponsored event. Thanks, Jim

I thought the points were going to count, but knowing how special this event is, how much FUN we will have, the hard work my fellow IMACers have put into it, and being there to see and meet some of the best pilots in the hobby, points or no points its going to be a blast.

If the event wasn't capped for us mortal pilots, the contest could have spun upwards of 100+ pilots and how can you have an event with that kind of attendance?

[sweetpea]

	Quote: Originally Posted by psk560
	The contest judging guide and the AMA rules contradict each other. One states that the unknowns need to be handed out the day before and one states that they can be handed out on the day of or day before. Contest guide: 12. All Unknowns will be made available to pilots on the day prior to when they will be flown. AMA rules: a. Unknowns shall be distributed the day of the contest or the night before to allow pilots to mentally fly and visualize them. If a contestant is found to have practiced the Unknowns with a flying model or on a computerized flight simulator, that contestant will be disqualified from the entire contest. Since the AMA sanctions our contests and we are an SIG I see the need to follow their rules. IMAC may want to consider rewording the contest judging guide to reflect that. The BOD needs to address this inconsistency. Clover Creek will rock! Craig

Actually its not inconsistent. The first one is the Contest Guide. The second one is the AMA Rule.

What you have is a guide (see suggestion to running a contest) and a rule that encompasses both the guide and rules by stating either the day prior or the day of. Basically AMA is saying that you "should" do the day prior to give the less experienced pilots a chance to visualize longer. The rule says no more than one day prior and can be the day of.

This also makes it possible for 3+ day contests to hand out unknowns every day instead of making folks show up the night prior for a 3+ contest just to get their unknown for the first day.


Now if I were the CD it would be simple.......Sanction my contest at least 30 days prior and in my flyers and contest application I would state if I planned to do "day of" unknowns because the Norm is night before in my current region. Of course this is just to help pilots know what they are in for at the contests. I have also always announced Sound/ACS/Pilot enforcement even those are in the rulebook. I don't want any excuse for a pilot from out of town or rookie to say "I didn't know". I treat all the pilots as rookies when I plan.

[Al Lewis]

	Quote:
	Hey Jeff, Downhumpty asked for more discussion so I gave my opinion. When you cap the classes for a National/Invitational special event like this, I think this falls outside the realm of a typical local contest where a CD like Tony hints at a cap. We are all extremely lucky to be flying IMAC at the birth of this event, for the hard work many people are putting into it, which looks to capture much or more of what the TOC had while opening it up to us mortal pilots too. I'm just surprised the points is such an issue considering there are so many other contest we can go to that are not capped, especially for the South East. I would have thought people would be more upset about the "National's" points not being counted, versus this Invitational/National-level/privately sponsored event. Thanks, Jim

Therein you see the reason for my original post stating that I wouldn't be joining or taking part in IMAC until they got their act together. They (the members) can't be consistent even with their own rules. Yeah, we have strict rules but hell guys, this is a big event with all the big guys we like to watch there so the hell with the rules. We're lucky to have them acknowledge us! There's big money involved. No thanks, if you can't play by your own rules then you can play by yourself.

[Dan_nO]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Jim Woodward
	I would have thought people would be more upset about the "National's" points not being counted

The NATS points not being counted ?