Kiwi's XPS test results are up.

[Reckless Loony]

	Quote: Originally Posted by XJet
	But just as JD refused to provide the parameters -- the guys from Boeing have been strangely silent about *how* they got it to hop.

This is what JD wrote last year with regards to the hopping.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...80&postcount=4

This is what Bruff wrote as one of the witnesses to this top-secret test.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...0&postcount=89

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...7&postcount=93

	Quote:
	over a period of 11 seconds using a signal within +/- 15MHz of the XBeePro's center-operating frequency

This is just more crap. The reason that JD wrote that is purely to discredit Tyhoc and Kiwi’s tests.

The Xbeepro modules centre frequency range is 2.41Ghz to 2.465Ghz in 5Mhz steps page 38 of the user manual with regards to the CH command clearly points this out.

• First off 2.41GHz – 15Mhz is outside the 2.4Ghz ISM band and is outside the frequency that the Xbeepro can even go too.
• 15Mhz away is 3 channels away for the Xbeepro modules. What crackpot would get their system to go looking for signal degradation 3 channels away?
• The Xbeepro modules can only measure received signal strength. In order to be able to get any signal strength readings 3 channels away they would have to change channels and in so doing it would take a relatively long time during which there is no controlling signal being sent to the aircraft during the hop (channel changing) sequence.
• Frequently channel hopping around on a DSSS system is an idiotic stupid thing to do as the constant changing of channels will crash your aircraft and that is why the Spektrum system and Assan systems don’t even try to hop once they are locked onto a channel(s). Remember the Xbeepro modules are DSSS just the same as Spektrum and Assan.

Let me also make it very clear people that changing channels does not make up for lack of antenna diversity. That is why when you look at JD’s XPS install in his own turbine jet he has the receiver mounted high up in the canopy on a pedestal to try and keep the antenna maintain a line of sight to the transmitter and not get this blocked by that large turbine jet engine.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...6&postcount=32

Just to make it clear the XPS system is the same as Assan X8 and Spektrum DX6 DSM (not the DX6i DSM2) park flyer systems.

[wrightme]

Huh?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISM_band
"2.400–2.500 GHz (centre frequency 2.450 GHz)"
2.415 ghz is WELL within the ISM band range.

"within +-15mhz" is WITHIN the range of +3 or -3 channels, not beyond it.

	Quote: Originally Posted by Reckless Loony
	The Xbeepro modules centre frequency range is 2.41Ghz to 2.465Ghz in 5Mhz steps page 38 of the user manual with regards to the CH command clearly points this out. First off 2.41GHz – 15Mhz is outside the 2.4Ghz ISM band and is outside the frequency that the Xbeepro can even go too. 15Mhz away is 3 channels away for the Xbeepro modules. What crackpot would get their system to go looking for signal degradation 3 channels away? The Xbeepro modules can only measure received signal strength. In order to be able to get any signal strength readings 3 channels away they would have to change channels and in so doing it would take a relatively long time during which there is no controlling signal being sent to the aircraft during the hop (channel changing) sequence. Frequently channel hopping around on a DSSS system is an idiotic stupid thing to do as the constant changing of channels will crash your aircraft and that is why the Spektrum system and Assan systems don’t even try to hop once they are locked onto a channel(s). Remember the Xbeepro modules are DSSS just the same as Spektrum and Assan. Let me also make it very clear people that changing channels does not make up for lack of antenna diversity. That is why when you look at JD’s XPS install in his own turbine jet he has the receiver mounted high up in the canopy on a pedestal to try and keep the antenna maintain a line of sight to the transmitter and not get this blocked by that large turbine jet engine. http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...6&postcount=32 Just to make it clear the XPS system is the same as Assan X8 and Spektrum DX6 DSM (not the DX6i DSM2) park flyer systems.

[easytiger]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Flyfalcons
	Why does Jim only post in forums where he can delete others' posts?

Because previously, when he was doing the EXACT SAME THING as he is doing now, slinging baloney, to sell paintball gear, he was on several boards, and he got "owned", as the kids say. There were too many people presenting too many facts that belied his claims, too many independent tests that showed he was a big ol' old fashioned liar. So he tried to take his ball and go home. On at least one site, he DEMANDED they remove all his posts or he would sue them. They refused. He also pulled the "I will spend a lot on advertising on your site if you just delete posts that are against me" thing, too. This stuff is all out there on the net.
RCgroups took his money, and are complicit in this whole thing. They can't feign ignorance, the owners knew Jim's past history, they were just "lucky" enough to get Jim's teeny advertising budget, and dishonest enough to be willing to be a partner in this unholy mess. They deserve whatever long-term loss of credibility they get from all this.

Hey, RCgroups: If you lay down with The Devil, sooner or later, you're going to hafta scr*w!

[easytiger]

All you guys debating the "frequency hopping" and talking about under what circumstances it MIGHT work, it's absurd. It does not work when someone turns on something on your frequency. That's it. Hence, it does not work at all. Like airbags that will only deploy at speeds over 175mph on your car. Yes, you have airbags. No, they don't do any good, no, you cannot hawk them as a safety feature.

The whole "hopping parameters" thing reminds me of that cartoon where Daffy Duck sells Porky Pig an insurance policy that will pay out one million dollars if Porky gets a black eye. But the fine print says that the black eye needs to be caused by a herd of wild elephants, on the Fourth of July, in a hailstorm, between 3:55 and 4:00pm only.
Oh, that fine print will get ya. See below? That's where Daffy is explaining the fine print to the fine print, it turns out it needs to be a herd of wild elephants AND one baby zebra(with a slowly rising noise floor?) to pay out...

[Reckless Loony]

	Quote: Originally Posted by wrightme
	Huh? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISM_band "2.400–2.500 GHz (centre frequency 2.450 GHz)"

	Quote: Originally Posted by wrightme
	2.415 ghz is WELL within the ISM band range. "within +-15mhz" is WITHIN the range of +3 or -3 channels, not beyond it.

I am referring to the operation of the Digi 2.4Ghz RF modules that JD uses in the XPS system. JD makes a claim of his XPS system and then I compare this claim against the Digi 2.4Ghz RF modules capability to see if they can do what JD claims of his XPS system.

A bit like me making the claim that my car can travel to the moon. But someone takes a peek under the bonnet where upon they discover that there is no rocket engine nor even life support. Therefore without the required hardware in place it is impossible for my car to even leave the ground let alone travel to the moon.

Now as to the frequencies the Digi 2.4Ghz RF modules use refer to the user manual here

http://ftp1.digi.com/support/documen...5.4_v1.xAx.pdf

Page 38 the CH (channel command)



The CH parameter range is 0C to 17 hexadecimal which in decimal is 12 to 23.

To understand the hexadecimal base 16 number system

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexadecimal

Anyway the frequencies the Xbeepro 2.4Ghz operate on is given by

Centre frequency = 2.405Ghz + (CH – 11) x 5Mhz

Thus 2.405Ghz + (12 – 11) x 5Mhz = 2.41Ghz

2.405Ghz + (13 – 11) x 5Mhz = 2.415Ghz

2.405Ghz + (14 – 11) x 5Mhz = 2.42Ghz

and so on till

2.405Ghz + (23 – 11) x 5Mhz = 2.465Ghz

These are the only frequencies the Xbeepro RF modules can be switched too. Thus for the lowest frequency of 2.41Ghz if we now apply the JD BS of looking for noise 15Mhz away then 2.41Ghz – 15Mhz = 2.395Ghz which is outside the 2.4Ghz ISM band and further more on a frequency that the Xbeepro RF module can’t change too because the lowest frequency that the modules can be switched to is 2.41Ghz.

Say the Xbeepro RF module is on 2.435Ghz and you want it changed to 2.41Ghz and the Xbeepro RF module is connected to your PC via the RS232 port then using Hyperterminal which is part of windows XP you would type.



<cr> means hitting the enter key on the PC keyboard.

Saving to the Xbeepro’s non-volatile memory is only required if it is desired the next time the Xbeepro module is powered up it will default to 2.41Ghz.

[easytiger]

In other words, if someone turns on on your frequency, as millions of devices out there can do, you will get shot down?

[Julez]

No, unless the RF power is strong enough to effectively block your current channel.
This seems seldom to be the case, but it seems to happen every once in a while nonetheless.

[easytiger]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Julez
	No, unless the RF power is strong enough to effectively block your current channel. This seems seldom to be the case, but it seems to happen every once in a while nonetheless.

What you mean is yes, unless your transmitter is stronger and or closer to your receiver than the interfering transmitter.
Being that there are literally millions of devices that are perfectly legal to use the same frequency you are using for XPS, it suddenly becomes LIKELY that you will be shot down, sooner or later.

[ss40]

	Quote: Originally Posted by easytiger
	What you mean is yes, unless your transmitter is stronger and or closer to your receiver than the interfering transmitter. Being that there are literally millions of devices that are perfectly legal to use the same frequency you are using for XPS, it suddenly becomes LIKELY that you will be shot down, sooner or later.

\

He said what he meant! What part of no you will not get shot down do you not understand?, unless you are swamped on the frequency which is EXTREMELY unlikely.
Lots of TX's on the same frequency can co-exist. You have completely revealed your total lack of understanding here.

[Simpleton]

	Quote: Originally Posted by easytiger
	RCgroups took his money, and are complicit in this whole thing. They can't feign ignorance, the owners knew Jim's past history, they were just "lucky" enough to get Jim's teeny advertising budget, and dishonest enough to be willing to be a partner in this unholy mess. They deserve whatever long-term loss of credibility they get from all this.

This is a bit puzzling, as they seem to be otherwise pretty good at keeping the undesirable riff-raff out.

[easytiger]

	Quote: Originally Posted by ss40
	He said what he meant! What part of no you will not get shot down do you not understand?, unless you are swamped on the frequency which is EXTREMELY unlikely. Lots of TX's on the same frequency can co-exist. You have completely revealed your total lack of understanding here.

Nope. You'll get shot down. Which is continuing to happen with XPS.

Ahhh, the Fanboys. Gotta love them. "What you don't understand is that the Sperical Radiation Technology causes an excitation of the negative aerion particles making XPS completely immune to interference, EVEN IF YOU ARE FLYING YOUR AIRPLANE UNDER A KITCHEN SINK. All you doubters are just working for Futaba and lack the technical understanding to even skim the SURFACE of the genius of a freindly alien like Jim Drew, who comes from a society so technologically advanced that the very laws of physics can be bent, warped, rechanneled, and alinged at will using just a mere fraction of Jim's mentallic powers!"

You guys got hornswoggled by a huckster. A guy who lies fairly fluently, and rather consistently. Deal with it.

Prove to me the veracity of Jim Drew. Show me where he went to college. He said he got three degrees from the U of Oregon, Klamath Falls. He did not. So...did he go to college at all?

Anyway...while this is all fun, it's kind of a sick joke at this point. It's all fun and games until somebody loses an eye, or crashes a triple-engined turbine onto a highway.

No matter how you slice it, it's still baloney.

[Flyfast1]

	Quote: Originally Posted by easytiger
	Nope. You'll get shot down. Which is continuing to happen with XPS. Ahhh, the Fanboys. Gotta love them. "What you don't understand is that the Sperical Radiation Technology causes an excitation of the negative aerion particles making XPS completely immune to interference, EVEN IF YOU ARE FLYING YOUR AIRPLANE UNDER A KITCHEN SINK. All you doubters are just working for Futaba and lack the technical understanding to even skim the SURFACE of the genius of a freindly alien like Jim Drew, who comes from a society so technologically advanced that the very laws of physics can be bent, warped, rechanneled, and alinged at will using just a mere fraction of Jim's mentallic powers!" You guys got hornswoggled by a huckster. A guy who lies fairly fluently, and rather consistently. Deal with it. Prove to me the veracity of Jim Drew. Show me where he went to college. He said he got three degrees from the U of Oregon, Klamath Falls. He did not. So...did he go to college at all? Anyway...while this is all fun, it's kind of a sick joke at this point. It's all fun and games until somebody loses an eye, or crashes a triple-engined turbine onto a highway. No matter how you slice it, it's still baloney.

Doesn't the binding provide some protection against other users? I have personally seen and used XPS with multiple other 2.4GHz radios operating at the same time (XPS, Spektrum, FAAST) and they appear to coexist just fine. I think even the XPS system frees the user from frequency pins.

-Ed B.