Problems!! 14MZ 2.4 R6014FS

[why_fly_high]

	Quote: Originally Posted by diamondave5
	why not just make engine sounds and push the plane around when its hot out, that would be the safest

And can be done in airconditioning!

Dan

[wrightme]

	Quote: Originally Posted by diamondave5
	why not just make engine sounds and push the plane around when its hot out, that would be the safest

	Quote: Originally Posted by why_fly_high
	And can be done in airconditioning! Dan

Why waste energy pushing a REAL model plane around. Sit in the chair, and let your THUMBS push the SIM plane around the screen! Then when the RX overheats, just push the red button.

Hey, wait! Where am I? I thought this was the XPS bashing thread...... Sure seems similar.....

[skymaster68]

has anyone had problens using 14 MZ 2.4 and JR servos?

[Julez]

	Quote: Originally Posted by ole
	I have read every post in this thread fro the last week or so. (slow reader) I am sure that a guy at Futaba could figure out there was or was not a problem within 1 hour of reading any one of these posts. And from all the people that have reproduced this on the ground, I believe there must be an issue here. So for the sake of argument, There is some issue with the RX most likely a heat related problem, or heat related restriction. So I am sure that an engineer reproduced it, then had his fellow engineers try it, and they reproduced it. They went and talked to their team lead, and he asked for verification. The team lead took this info to his manager, and the manager asked for more clarification and testing. After this testing they found that the failure is in a part they buy from another company, at the cost of $ 0.50 per RX. So here you have a problem, are all components bad, or just a batch of them. If all, quicker solution all are bad, or if just a batch. How do you tell what is good and what is bad. Yet you have another problem. Any crash on a warm day running this new 2.4 Futaba RX should not be a cost to the end user, but a cost to Futaba, and Futaba does not like buying fire wood. Also any RX already sent out should be recalled, and no one likes to send out free stuff and pay shipping. So even if there is a problem. Futaba corporate is looking for existing documentation or other type of information that would make this a documented limitation on existing RX. So the problem was and end user problem for using it outside the temperature limits of the RX. And if the component was form another company. Does that company have enough funds to help offset the cost of the recall, or the cost that should be paid to a crashed aircraft owner. And I am sure most corporate lawyers would like to make sure any statement is released properly, with minimal damage to the company. I am sure the Engineer at Futaba just wanted to say. Yep there is a problem, but is not allowed to do so. Yet this is just a Hobby, so the solution is simple. Put the RX in a place where it will receive good air flow from the prop if at all possible but not the heat of the engine, so it will cool on the ground after starting. Also exit vents should be twice the intake vents for good airflow. And put it in a place where the 2 antenna are located as recommended. Cover your airplane with a towel or something when sitting out in the sun. Fly and have fun.

errr...you did read that the responsible component was already indentified?
It took me about 40min to reveal that the transciever is rated to 60°C.
And I had nothing to start with; Futaba just has to dig through all their datasheets and find the part with the lowest temperature rating.
I guess the problem is, that the whole RX design depends on this transciever, which cannot be replaced all of a sudden.
The behaviour some of us see is normal, not a fault. Exceed the specs limits, and you have a failure.

[DR10044]

	Quote: Originally Posted by skymaster68
	has anyone had problens using 14 MZ 2.4 and JR servos?

Not so far, running 8711's.

[Jurgen Heilig]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Julez
	errr...you did read that the responsible component was already indentified? It took me about 40min to reveal that the transciever is rated to 60°C. And I had nothing to start with; Futaba just has to dig through all their datasheets and find the part with the lowest temperature rating. ...

Hi Julez,

could you please check for components which fail at even lower temperatures? You know I started a thread on RC-Network about potential heat issues with 2.4GHz systems. Two models crashed last weekend wit R608FS on board. During ground tests, three R608FS failed at just 45°C (=113°F).

Jürgen

[DR10044]

With Nall getting ready to go full steam, we may find out if this is a major problem or not.

[jonkoppisch]

Exactly what I was thinking!!! Along with all of the other 2.4 systems as well... Although, from the weather outlook, they may not get used as much as usual..

[Flyfalcons]

We'll get to see how FASST and Spektrum both perform in tornados!

[diamondave5]

i was thinking some people said to just mount the reciever not under the canopy, well mine failed in arizona in late april, and it was pretty far down in the plane under a dark tinted canopy, how do we know that come mid june they wont fail in any location in the plane?? i think we should encourage a solution to the flaw rather than masking over it, i realize any part can fail without a warning sometimes, but this is what seems to be a known issue now, why take that chance, they shouldnt be bought, sold, or used in this current condition, its only going to take one time and someone can actually get hurt, this hobby is supposed to be relatively safe, its not motor cross or sky diving, something like that with a higher danger factor, imo these things arent safe to the general public, yeh some people could install fans and things like that, but what about the guy that just buys this thing, doenst see all these posts, puts it in the plane just like he has his pcm's for the past 5 years, and then something goes wrong, not good...something is clearly different internally(other than the obvious stuff) than that of previous futaba recievers, both pcm and older fm, just thinking out loud here

[grayuk]

Put a canopy floor in, paint it white and make sure the rx is under it.
You need to isolate the radiant heated air from the rest of the plane.
Ambient temps are not hot enough to make the rx fail.
As has been said, the hottest day recorded anywhere was 57C (Africa).
If the rx is rated to 60C then that might just cause it to fail..
The failure is caused by radiant energy being concentrated by the canopy and heating the air/objects within and forcing temps higher than ambient (70C and above).
Without radiant energy a non-heat producing item cannot exceed ambient.
When the rx is turned on it does produce some heat which will raise its temp to around 5C above ambient (see previous posts).
Having said all that I still think that Futaba need to look at this, but I am sure if you do the above you will not see a failure. Try it, all you have to gain is some flying time!

Paul

[Jurgen Heilig]

	Quote: Originally Posted by DR10044
	With Nall getting ready to go full steam, we may find out if this is a major problem or not.

Hopefully there won't be a problem. Event Organizers and pilots should be aware by now about potential temperature issues. Some blankets and/or sun umbrellas should provide enough protection.

Jürgen