Originally Posted by jdmilla

It seems to me that half the discussions on this forum revolve around the guilty pleasure of buying products from China. We are the victims of our own capitalism. The US forced open the Japanese markets over a hundred years ago. Cheap crappy imports from Japan turned into high quality gold-standard products over the course of time. Capitalism will take care of itself. Nobody will by inferior products. I personally think the Chinese economy will implode for a variety of reasons including unfair practices, complete disregard for safety, disregard for the environment and manipulation of the currency. 7000 miners died in China last year. 7000! They just fill in the hole and keep digging. Milk, glycerine, pet food etc. Someday enough will be enough, but not yet. Once their population starts enjoying a higher standard of living, prices will rise, quality will go up and they will go to the next underdeveloped country to outsource.

The answer to me is to sell products into China. The company I work for sells food processing systems. We have installed over 25 tomato processing plants in China. We have built a manufacturing facility in Shanghai and we lease our equipment. We have the best technology and expertise and we work every day to stay ahead of the copycats. We are all bemoaning the decline of western civilization. Let's do something about it.

Off my soapbox. My first and last comment on the subject.

That is really similar to what my AP Economics teacher said. Pretty soon, we'll be complaining about how crappy Indian products are.

Originally Posted by flatspinjim

The funniest thing about the Da vs Chinese debate.....Just about every engine is going into a chinese built plane!

Something which I have pointed out a few times but yet to see a reply.

Originally Posted by flatspinjim

But there again, if you stay with the american companies selling these planes, built to their specs, as in Wildhare, Areoworks and such you get a very good product

I had a wildhare and it went straight back to the shop. I have more than ten electric and gas no-name chinese models, while not perfect, they are all very good. Some are close to perfect as I have ever seen.

Hope your engine works out. Myself I still have not had the stones to buy direct from China.

Oh well. I have been offline for a few days and this XYZ not working out is news to me.

Meanwhile my DL is still going strong. Still hoping to buy their twin. Or maybe the 3M/TOC whatever 80 when it hits. All in all I guess so far the DL has produced the strongest I've seen. With the 3MM being right with it with reliability. There for a minute I thought the XYZ line would fill out the "big three" in the Chinese engine group. Might be MT after all.

I almost ordered a DL 50 direct from china.. After payment problems, and shipping problems, i got my money back and ordered a DL-55 from troybuilt... Good thing... My buddy got a DL from china and it was a dud... and now theres no response...

its like a copy paste of the thread when DL50 was comming out...

I think we just have to face the facts. people will buy a cheaper engine if it proves itself in the field long enough. DL is certainly on its way to becoming one of the brand name engines. Other people will buy cheaper engines to get into the sport, and thats all they can afford. unfortunately, they will be the ones that get burned as the crappy engines will cease to be manufactured and serviced. when the crappy engines prove to be just that.... Crappy engines, noone will buy them and the company producing them will either go bust or move onto something else.
there are some good engines being produced at a reasonable price, but once they become better proven and better known, I have no doubt the prices will creep up. I am more than happy with my DL's and DZY. I would like to have bought a DA due to their reputation but couldn't afford it, so I went with what was proving to be a good second.....I am sure they will prove to be as good, if not better than other brand names in the long term.

If clones keep cloning clones, will there be a bad mutation? The 50cc that ate San Fransisco.

Originally Posted by jdmilla

If clones keep cloning clones, will there be a bad mutation? The 50cc that ate San Fransisco.

That's already happened. Behold the DL with 4 heads!!

I ordered my engine from Hobby City on Friday night................the next night I was prompted that the engine was shipped out, which means it will be here Wednesday/Thursday. Paying with Paypal was instant too.............thats good service !! What more can you ask for ?

Flyer88

Originally Posted by flatspinjim

The funniest thing about the Da vs Chinese debate.....Just about every engine is going into a chinese built plane! But there again, if you stay with the american companies selling these planes, built to their specs, as in Wildhare, Areoworks and such you get a very good product

I do not know of but one company that specs and goes to China to test fly and inspect the products and that is Extreme Flight RC, From what I have seen all others are a copy of Extreme flight RC.

but I have been known to be wrong one time.

Milton

Originally Posted by 66stang

Fifty, the difference for me was I was personaly involved! I saw what the product could be if they kept up the quality. They started to cut corners and decided to just throw out motors and not keep to the standard that Ron asked from them. Now if you take my DL it has exceeded my expectations. I have never needed to have it serviced. I hate to break the news to all. There really is not much made in the states only. So when you start this saying buy DA an american made motor and drive a honda, I say bull! I'm not pointing at just you, but you do drive a honda. I drive a ford.

I understand completely as another china rip-off happened close to home, for me. Before that, I didn't care, more motor for less, as we discussed at the Nall. Now, all of the sudden tables have turned. I'm not saying buy DA because it's American, I'm saying buy DA, 3W, etc. as they are not stolen from someone else, just as Ron's motors were. When he starts selling motors again, buy it. As far as my car, the Honda Accord was the first Japanese design to be produced in America. ( Marysville, Ohio since 1982)

Originally Posted by RCEXTREMEPOWER

I do not know of but one company that specs and goes to China to test fly and inspect the products and that is Extreme Flight RC, From what I have seen all others are a copy of Extreme flight RC.

but I have been known to be wrong one time.

Milton

Wasn't "plugging" any certain product, just saying that some good things do come out of China

Originally Posted by 3Dguy

That's already happened. Behold the DL with 4 heads!!

LOL!

Flyer88 I wish you all the best with your new engine. As I did all of the Beta testing on the 50HP I'll give you a few things to look for that were a major problem in the pre-production engine. Check the rod bearings to see if they were made in Germany (they will say GERMANY on the side of the cup), if not they are probably the Chinese ones I had them replace. They wear out after about 5 flights. After you run the engine a couple times pull the cylinder and see if it looks like an octagon inside. They had extremely out-of-round bores with taper in them. Don't hone the cylinder as they have only put about .0013" of hard chrome plate on them. Check the hub for run-out. Some of the ones shipped to Ron ran out .025-.030". Also check it for cracks. Check the threads in the head for the spark plug. These were also so bad the plugs were just stripping out during flight. They also changed the design driving the rotary valve at the last minute. I haven't tested one of these but it looks as though it might cause more friction and wear out quicker. I also found that the cylinder gasket leaked a bit. I cured this by replacing it with a line of Red High Temp Permatex around the base of the cylinder instead of a gasket. Once again good luck, especially if you need service.

Al;

Thanks for the advice! I'll keep an eye on it.

I'm really not as picky as some of you purists out there, as all I want to do is fly my yak and enjoy the experience without worrying about being ripped off on my engine.

I come from a background of competitive cycling with guys who were at and above the National level. Allot of the time it wasn't the guy (who was sponsored) with the prettiest, most high tech bike that got to the top of the mountain and back down the other side first. It was the guy who rode the heaviest, ugliest ride imaginable, because it's the rider not the bike that finishes the race. I share the same ideas with flying, as it's not the engine or the speed of your servos that makes the plane, but the pilot that makes the plane look better than it may be.

Let's stop taking things so seriously and enjoy the HOBBY for what it is.......................because when it's all said and done I want my headstone to read: LOVED TO FLY! not PISSED OFF AT THE COMPETITION!

Flyer88