I hate judging!, damned if you do and damned if you don't. There is always someone who feels that you judged them unfairly!

rcgood I liked your pic that does help seeing things at all angles to get a base to judge by.

Originally Posted by rcgood

That's a good point. They do say .5 for every 5 degrees. So if it's not 5...But then again they used to say 1 point for every 10 degrees and you were still supposed to deduct .5 for 5 degrees. I usually deduct .5 if I notice a difference. It looks like I could be wrong.

BTW...The pics that I posted, the first one is actually perfectly level and the 2nd one is 10 degrees off. You were very close . The point I was trying to make though is how when you're out and above it look like your inside wing is up when it's actually level.

This right here is one of the toughest things for a Basic pilot to learn in all of IMAC - how to tell your wings are level - or NOT!!!

Bobby aka TDD

Originally Posted by rcgood

Here's a couple of examples I just did. I tried to place the plane about where it would be when judging (passing right in front) plus this one is a foamie. You guys wanna take a guess what angles these two pictures are at?

Hard to tell in 2D - in fact it's impossible.

That's not 2D it's in 3D. Just the jpeg of it was export in 2D (which is what you see anyway).

Originally Posted by rcgood

That's not 2D it's in 3D. Just the jpeg of it was export in 2D (which is what you see anyway).

Except in real life, you do see 3D. You have depth perception, and a frame of reference as to the position and attitude of the plane...

That's not completely true. I don't think the depth perception or frame of reference necesarily tells you the attitude of the plane. You have to learn that. At least that was my experience when I started doing IMAC. I had to learn (and still learning) what wings level looks like in different attitudes even in simple ones like flying a straight line parrallel to runway. Upright AND inverted.

Originally Posted by rcgood

That's not completely true. I don't think the depth perception or frame of reference necesarily tells you the attitude of the plane. You have to learn that. At least that was my experience when I started doing IMAC. I had to learn (and still learning) what wings level looks like in different attitudes even in simple ones like flying a straight line parrallel to runway. Upright AND inverted.

Agreed, this does take time to learn. But at the VERY least you need a horizon and scale reference to begin to tell the roll attitude. If you saw the plane as shown in those pictures directly out from you, it would be rolled away from you. However, if you saw it several hundred feet high and just on the other side of the runway and it looked as it does in the picture, it would actually be rolled toward you.

Once you get that far out, you're seeing in 2D anyway, so assuming that the pics were taken with horizon level, people should be able to know how many degrees something is off by. Yet another thing confusing about IMAC .

I said 1 because I thought it was 10 degrees. But according to the rules since it is 9 it should really be a .5 deduction, right?

Lol, there's not even agreement with that .
So is it >0 - 5 = .5 deduction, 6-10 = 1 point deduction,

or 0-5' freebie, 6-10 0.5 deduction

Originally Posted by BoneDoc

Lol, there's not even agreement with that .
So is it >0 - 5 = .5 deduction, 6-10 = 1 point deduction,

or 0-5' freebie, 6-10 0.5 deduction

No way 0-5 is a freebie. If it's a couple of degrees off I doubt you could tell realistically if it's 4-5 degrees it's a deduction. At least that's how I do it.

You been flying lately? Haven't seen you at the field in a while.

Yep, but I'm in San Diego right now (until the end of March). I'll be back in April. So did you get your 35% finished?

The rule is 0 to 4.5 degrees is no deduction, 5 to 9.5 degrees is .5 deduction. 10 to 14.5 degrees is 1 point deduction.
We just trained on this at our Judges School two days ago.

Dan Baker

Dan I was thinking that is what I had heard at the the one I was at. Thanks for pointing it out. Gary