Originally Posted by Kiwi

Gents,

At great peril I am going to leak some preproduction information regarding the two new Power Expanders Robert has been developing at Smart-Fly. I promised not tell too many people so I figured the FG column does not mean the whole world so here goes.

The new units are from Smart-Fly's new stable of Power Expander Sport Plus and the Power System Sport Plus (with the regulator).

The units are designed for the 100cc and under gas powered models and in my mind they have combined all the necessary stuff in a simple to mount neat and functional assembly.

They are totally compatible with the new SPEKTRUM and FUTABA 2.4 Ghz receivers.

Whats new.

Two models.

One with a regulator for Li-Po batts and the other without a reg for NiMh or NiCd packs. Both have the built in ignition kill system on the board.

General details for the regulated version are as follows:

1. Built in Battshare so if you use two battery packs (you can use one if thats all you want) and the system keeps the voltage within a whisker of each other on both packs so you maintain balanced packs all the way as they discharge.
2. The regulator is built into the power expander and is NOT adjustable. I have not yet run this demo unit over my test system yet but I assume the regulated voltage will be 6 volts to the servos and 5 volts to the receiver.
3. Maximum recommended continuous current draw through the regulator is around 5 amps with peak load capacity of 15 amps so thats plenty enough for a 35% plane running good digital servos.
4. The fiber optic ignition kill system is also built into the board. You just run a jumper wire from the kill switch channel you choose to the Ign plug on the front of the board and your setup.
5. The unit is a feather weight. 2 oz roughly plus a few inches of Fiber optic cable and the kill switch receiver and you done.
6. Battery plugs are the JR or Futaba type spade plugs so no need for fancy deans or Graupner six pin setups.
7. You can use 7.4 volt Li-Ions or even Li-PO's if that takes your fancy. I don't use Li-Po's on gassers due to the intolerance to vibration but it can be done and many do it so I cant bag it.

I had an EQ10 with two 4800 Li-On packs with a turbo reg etc in my 35% 260. By going to this setup with twin 2400 packs I can reduce the electronics load in this plane by 11oz . Thats some serious weight to haul around when your trying to run it on an 80cc engine.

If you have any questions about this device ask them here please. Tony, Robert or myself will be in as often as possible to help answer anything you have.

Price?? Not finalized but you better believe they are not expensive.

Availability?? There may be some on display at the NALL but shipping will be about another month or so after.

Hope you like them guys.

I am new to all this since I am building my first 35% before this my biggest one was 30 % and I did everything straight to the receiver with 1 battery nothing fancy now is a whole new world for me with all these cuurrent draws and differents amps that I never pay attention before, so here I am trying to install the easiest possible set up for my 35 % AM/SD yak with 8 5955 servos so basically you would say this is the appropiate set up? so there is no need for dean plugs anywhere?
Thanks

I will be running a 5200 fromeco I am still debating if I go with 2 batteries I am looking for the lightest set up.

Caurimare.

Ok a 35% plane with 8 high current servos needs a power system in my humble opinion. I know guys are going to come in here and jump down my throat for saying that but thats cool. I'm entitled to my opinions and I am only sharing my way of doing it. I do not for a minute say this is the only way.

OK I would highly recommend a super regulator at the minimum with a power expander of your choice. Because your servos are programmable you don't really need something like the EQ10 so go a level down without the equalizers built into the board.

If you go down the 5200 single battery you are leaving yourself way too open for a failure in the battery department, plus your likely going to have some voltage drop because your only feeding the servos through a single cable. The voltage drop will be minimal and not worth paying a great deal of attention too but it will happen. Twin 2600 packs weigh the same as a single 5200 so your no worse off.

I strongly recommend twin 2600 FROMECO packs. This gives you the same capacity with a secure battery back up in case one pack fails.

The Smart-Fly regulator can be fitted with a single failsafe switch also so you don't need to have multiple switches just because you have twin battery packs.

Not sure what engine your running but if its a gasser PLEASE fit it with a failsafe ignition kill switch. There are many brands but SF make a very good optical unit. If the ignition is 8.6 volt capable then I recommend a Fromeco 2600 as well but if not use a good quality NiCd pack of some 2000 Mah capacity and you will never have a problem.

Feel free to post here if you need any help. I will watch out on this thread for you.

Thanks for sharing... A lot of neat things now all in one. I love their products and support. One question KIWI... seems a few guys don't like batshare's and I see this has it integrated in it? Care to eleborate? Can it be turned off and use both packs equally without sharing? And second, will 2x2600 packs be enough under 3D load? Can they push enough amps? I am going through this right now setting up my 35%...

Originally Posted by Kiwi

Caurimare.

Ok a 35% plane with 8 high current servos needs a power system in my humble opinion. I know guys are going to come in here and jump down my throat for saying that but thats cool. I'm entitled to my opinions and I am only sharing my way of doing it. I do not for a minute say this is the only way.

OK I would highly recommend a super regulator at the minimum with a power expander of your choice. Because your servos are programmable you don't really need something like the EQ10 so go a level down without the equalizers built into the board.

If you go down the 5200 single battery you are leaving yourself way too open for a failure in the battery department, plus your likely going to have some voltage drop because your only feeding the servos through a single cable. The voltage drop will be minimal and not worth paying a great deal of attention too but it will happen. Twin 2600 packs weigh the same as a single 5200 so your no worse off.

I strongly recommend twin 2600 FROMECO packs. This gives you the same capacity with a secure battery back up in case one pack fails.

The Smart-Fly regulator can be fitted with a single failsafe switch also so you don't need to have multiple switches just because you have twin battery packs.

Not sure what engine your running but if its a gasser PLEASE fit it with a failsafe ignition kill switch. There are many brands but SF make a very good optical unit. If the ignition is 8.6 volt capable then I recommend a Fromeco 2600 as well but if not use a good quality NiCd pack of some 2000 Mah capacity and you will never have a problem.

Feel free to post here if you need any help. I will watch out on this thread for you.

Kiwi thanks alot
I was under the impresion that with the new Power System Sport Plus you wouldn't need to use a turbo regulator like you recomend? as far as the engine it is a DA100
Thanks again

Kiwi also I see that with the new Power System Sport Plus you dont use deans conectors as you woud with the other set up that you were recommending me, wich of the two system in your opinoin would be the best for my application.
Thanks

Darn, I wish you would have leaked this a month ago, I just bought one for my Carden Cap 35%.
Boo Hooo Hooo! Next time.

I am confused why there is an optical ignition kill switch when the ignition regulator is on the board. The purpose of the optical ignition switch is to isolate the ignition from the receiver (both electrically and physically). If the wires from the ignition are running back to the power expander, you might as well just shut it off there. There may be no concerns having the ignition run this close to the receiver but why the remote optical switch. I could see an on board optical switch to electrically isolate the ignition from the receiver. Please explain to me what purpose the remote optical kill switch offers in this setup.

Originally Posted by caurimare

I will be running a 5200 fromeco I am still debating if I go with 2 batteries I am looking for the lightest set up.

Why not have Fromeco do some custome wiring on your 5200, a 5200 is just 2 2600 in paraell, they should be able to wite it so you have two sets of leads coming from the pack, then run these through two switches and hook to the expander, you get the safety and redundancy of 2 packs but only have one.

WHOOOO!, Looks like I was away for a day or two and missed all this so I will do my best to answer. Robert is at the Joe Nall (I am not jealous much) so he wont be in here to help me if I get it wrong until next week.

Hybris, Your question is easy to answer first. The ignition cut off is fiber optic. The battery pack and receiver from the Optical transmitter(thats built into the board) are mounted up near the engine some place. The transmitter on the PEX board on lt sends a light signal up a plastic tube and triggers the switch. There is no hard wiring at all back to the PEX. Its all done with smoke and mirrors. The regulator you see on the board is not the ignition regulator. It is the main power regulator for two battery packs. That regulator is feed from a Battshare system as well to keep both packs evenly discharged.

DAN, GREMLIN I 'm sure FROMECO can make a hybrid pack but I dont see any real advantages in doing that as the battshare is really only a battery balancer. It drags current off the highest voltage pack until they are level pegging then it draws them down evenly. If Kurt and the guys made you a pack with two power leads it would basically be doing the same thing I think.

Caurimare Please dont misunderstand my comments regarding the turbo reg. For a 100cc application a super reg is plenty. That is what is built into the new PEX as well. Both these new boards are designed for a maximum sized model of 100cc. That assumes a plane with about seven to eight medium duty servos. 5955 and the likes. The super reg can handle something like 15 amps continuous if it is cooled properly. Robert has been extremely conservative with the ratings on his regulators so they wont fall over on you at 7 amps. I have tested them and have some new ones in transit to do some testing and show you all what sort of punishment these regs can take. Hang in until they arrive and I will see what sort of smoke we can produce with them.

Guys I'm writing this with a coke in one hand and a sandwich in the other. If I messed up here with any information blame it on the sandwich please. Its too good to put down.

Kiwi.. thanks for the replies. So, really, it is only operating off of 1 2600 pack, which is only good for 4 amps... It would be 8 amps IF you could discharge both packs at the same time, equally. I am a little nervous about only 4 amps with 8 5955's on 3D throws! The 5200 series Fromeco's will discharge at 8 amps if I am correct. I think that was my question. For a 100cc bird you would only still go with 2600's? Thanks for the questions... not interrogations! LOL

Gremlin.

It draws off both packs and it will drag way more than 4 amps I promise you. The battshare only really works when there is no load or very limited load but as soon as you apply load the voltage will drop on the high pack (we are talking zillionths of a volt here) and the other pack comes in the work in parallel. If you have two 2400 Mah Fromeco packs you will have continuous access to about 5C on each pack. Thats a short circuit capacity of around 20 amps.

However if you have a 5C load on each pack for any length of time mate, you have more problems than I care to mention. Like locked, ganged servos or such.

The sports series are specifically designed for 50cc to 100cc models. Good packs with 20g battery cables gives you an assured current capacity of 6 amps continuous to the PEX. A properly setup servo system even with ganged servos should only draw 100 to 150 Mah at idle. The JR style plugs while rated at 3 amps continuous (3000 Mah) will surely tolerate a spike of as much as 7 or 8 amps. (8000 Mah) But just for a spike, not continuous.

In these sized expanders there is ample protection as they are rated at a fraction of their real capacity.

kiwi one more thing that has me thinking is that with the new Power System Sport Plus (with the regulator) you guys don't use deans conectors as oppose of the old styles and whats on smart-fly web site
"The Power Expander will provide benefits for 33% planes and up. The unit provides power where it is needed when it is needed. One might ask why you would want to put a Power Expander in a 33% plane when you can support all the servos needed on your receiver ports alone. The answer to this question lies in how the receiver is connected to the battery pack. The normal connection from receiver to battery pack is through a single connector with 22 gauge wire. The normal RC connector is rated at about 3.5A. Digital servos in full stall can draw between 1.5A and 2.5A. With six of these digitals on the plane’s aerodynamic surfaces you can see that the power capability of the battery connector is quickly exceeded. What does this mean? What happens is that you start losing voltage? When you loose voltage to the servos you loose torque, and when you loose torque you loose holding power. You think you don’t have big enough servos on the plane so you go to bigger servos when in reality if you had supplied the full voltage to the servos when needed you probably would not have had to go to larger servos. The Power Expander allows you to provide full voltage to the servos resulting in stronger servos holding power"
so with new power expanders is there something improve so you don't need the deans conectors or do you need them or not?
Thanks again for so many questions.

Originally Posted by Kiwi

WHOOOO!,

Hybris, Your question is easy to answer first. The ignition cut off is fiber optic. The battery pack and receiver from the Optical transmitter(thats built into the board) are mounted up near the engine some place. The transmitter on the PEX board on lt sends a light signal up a plastic tube and triggers the switch. There is no hard wiring at all back to the PEX. Its all done with smoke and mirrors. The regulator you see on the board is not the ignition regulator. It is the main power regulator for two battery packs. That regulator is feed from a Battshare system as well to keep both packs evenly discharged.

Your right, I miss read one of the previous posts. I saw "ignition" and "regulator" in one sentence and made my own conclusion. This system makes complete sense now. Thanks for clarifying. When can we get one? I just wish I didn't just buy a smartfly ignition kill and MPI regulators last week.

Bob has the new boards due for delivery in the very near future. They were late arriving as it was his intention to have some at the Nall. Of course the supplier missed the deadline. I would need Bob to give you a date but I expect the next couple of weeks will see them up and available.