Come b*tch & moan with TBob

[50%plane]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Hoosier06
	Funny thing is that T-Bobs thoughts on the plane are and will be uttered at most fields and club meetings.

True dat!

[yakwrecker]

T,
The diffrence between the wing area on the GP compared to the carden 300 is 238sq. in. I dont know how significant that is but it cant be to much because i watched andrew make a dead stick with it at the DOGS show and if it werent for the headwind it would have floated the whole distance of the runway. Im just trying to say that it really isnt that heavy. It's still a big airplane. Im not trying to convince you of anything because i really dont care. But its proven itself to me and i bet you'd like it if you got to fly one. Same with the CAP580 which was rated at 29lbs. Lets just try to give this one a chance.
Jon

[Chris]

I swore I'd never buy another GP plane after the 1/3 scale Pitts. Total POS. Too heavy. Poor design. Poor construction. Then they came out with their "new" designs and they aren't any better. Somebody already pointed out the 77" plane with a one-piece wing. DUH!! Thats just ignorant. Now they come out with a 40% plane thats 10 pounds overweight? Yup, they DO build airplanes in a vacuum.

Here's what I think of GP BARF's
:24::24::24:

Never again!!

[Josh Price]

Every one has the right to their own opinion. the diversity in set ups and planes is what makes this a great hobby. you can do it your way and screw everyone else if they do it different. I have flown the 43cc gass 3d cap, yak, and su-31 and let me say man they are all awesome planes. I have talked to a good friend of mine at hobbico and some changes have been made even in the last year (i.e. wing spars)
so I guess its all about what you like. I watched Frank fly this thing at the dogs and I thought it looked awesome.

my .02

[aviti]

Also remember that a very large part of what Hobbico sells is through hobby shops. You won't find many hobby shops carrying Cardens or Aeroworks or SD Models. So when they try to envision their products on the shelf, it has to appeal to the guy browsing the LHS and this plane is a lot of plane for a small price. They have the distribution channel set up and they know what they are doing. It will sell and I bet most people that buy it will be very happy with it.

[thewrap]

110in wingspan. I think there are 40%ers' running 125in. But we've made it just fine without this contribution from Tower so I think they might lighten it up some what.

[reyn3545]

Weight is important, but it sure ain't everything..

I had a Lanier Ultimate bipe a few years ago, bought it used from a guy in California. It had a worn out Saito 150 on it, I think it weighed about 13 pounds with a 5-foot wingspan. It flew like you might expect, but it was straight as an arrow and rock solid. I "landed" it on an asphault runway one day, coming in way too fast... as soon as the gear touched, I dumb-thumbed it and nosed it over, breaking the landing gear plate and collapsing the gear backwards. It skidded at least 100 feet down the asphault tricycling on the gear and the nose. When it was all over, the only damage was the gear plate, lots of scratches on the head of the worn out Saito, and a few scratches on the cowl.

For a novice flyer that was itching for a bipe, I probably couldn't have chosen a better one.

In my basement now, I have an Extreme Flight 74" Yak... It is absolutely the worst flying piece of schidt (to be a precision craft) that I've ever owned. The stab incidence was off from the factory, I had to re-drill the dowel holes to level them out. The wing incidence is still off due to warping. I almost lost it on the maiden trying to fight the twisting and diving at the same time. Its light as a feather, but it flies like a boomerang. With it trimmed out for level flight, whenever you hit the rudder, it starts twisting hard. Not the normal rudder coupling that you'd expect, I mean hard twisting, getting worse with the more speed involved. I've mixed most of it out, but its still a pain.

Anyway, sorry for dragging everyone down that path... my point was, like many have pointed out, there are many types of planes and flying styles, and each plane is designed for a particular market. I'm not a 3D flyer, so the EF Yak is just a bad choice for me.. not necesarily a bad plane. The Lanier was a good, sturdy first step in to larger scale for a novice flyer, but my 3D buddy cringed when we weighed it.

I'm finishing up the new Aeroworks Pitts Python, my third AW plane, and I've got an Extreme Composites 100cc Edge 540 ready to go. Both offer different challenges, and are VERY different flyers. At 19 pounds, the Python isn't going to win any 3D contests, but the smoke system combined with 50 degrees of throw on all surfaces should make it a very fun aircraft! The composite Edge 540 is... well, its just a georgous great flying plane. Now I can take something to the field that suits my mood for the day. And if I have anger management problems and need to go abuse a plane... there's always the "Flying Banana" Yak sitting there!

[bodywerks]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Chris
	I swore I'd never buy another GP plane after the 1/3 scale Pitts. Total POS. Too heavy. Poor design. Poor construction. Then they came out with their "new" designs and they aren't any better. Somebody already pointed out the 77" plane with a one-piece wing. DUH!! Thats just ignorant. Now they come out with a 40% plane thats 10 pounds overweight? Yup, they DO build airplanes in a vacuum. Here's what I think of GP BARF's :24::24::24: Never again!!

It's not a 40%er, it's 38%, and it's not 10 pounds overweight, more like two. If it comes in under 36 pounds, which I believe will be possible, then it will not be all that heavy. But it is still too small...

[Kiwi]

And if you have not seen it fly or flown it then I really ask you guys how you can flame it so badly.

I was at the Dogs and watched Frank and Andrew fly them. There was never a hint of any wing rock in harriers, they roll like Mark Leseburg is driving them.

And the dead stick Andrew had showed the things are floaters.

As always there's the pedantic knockers who like making noise for the sake of noise but I bet they sell like hotcakes, they will have lots of proud owners.

On the weight issue there is one thing a heavy plane does that a light weight 3D plan won't and I mean never. Light as a feather models dont do scale aerobatics. You need inertia to do some such as lomchevaks. No 35 Lb 40% can pull those off even close to scale so its horses for courses in a lot of cases.

If the guys at sea level with a DA150 or a 3W157 in these planes it will perform to the limit of most pilots, and it cant do better than that. 90% of the way a plane flies is setup and thumbs. A pound or two either way makes no difference.

[mikel7099]

And if you have not seen it fly or flown it then I really ask you guys how you can flame it so badly.



T boob is good at that. Needs a life.

[dunny]

...............everything is in the name..............

Dunny

[dubd]

Over weight or not. Tunnel or not. The simple fact that based on the specs that many people are not enthusiastic is an indication that Great Planes did not do their homework in terms of what giant scale buyers are looking for. In this market you need every competitive advantage and cost is only one of them. The plane may be $1000, but total up cost is going to be at least 3 times more and MOST modelers are not going to spend $3k on impulse, especially in this economy.

[reyn3545]

I agree, the "total up cost" could get up to $3K easy, but the folks that buy this bird are going to cut the expected corners... a used engine, maybe one of the chinese knock-offs, non-digital servos, no smart-fly, etc.. Everybody has their own idea of what's safe, what's the best balance of money/quality, etc.. You see a lot of those secondary market vendors buying banner space on this website. Overall, its good to get more people involved in the hobby, and I guess its up to the leadership at each field to inspect a machine before it maidens. Maybe we should pass out crash helmets to everyone at the pilot stands!

[T. Bob]

You guys are right.
When the plane comes out and people are flying it everyone will know it’s a pig.

What pisses me is the article in Model Aviation News. It never states the weight. All eight other reviews, in the same issue, the weight is on the first page in the “Specifications” box.
To me this is very deceiving and the magazine should come clean. Tell the truth or don’t print the article. Tower did the right thing and printed the weight at 38 lbs.

Everyone here is saying wait till it’s released and pilots are flying them before we pass judgment.

The question is, who is that first pilot going to be?

[bodywerks]

T.bob, I think the only people that will get this plane up to 38 pounds are the people that don't know any better - people that think you need a car starter battery to power the servos. To those people it won't matter. If they all end up at that weight, then it will definitely be a huge dissapointment, but all the ones flying right now have been 36 pounds, and they are prototypes.
I am still with you that it is too small for veteran 150cc flyers, and that they definitely missed the mark by not making it able to fit cans(then again, who would want to add that weight to such a small plane?).
However, Kiwi is right, it will probably still sell like hot cakes.