Official Futaba 6EX, 7C and TM-7 Service Advisory

[GREAT PLANES]

Hi, All-

Below you will find the 'official' Service Advisory pertaining to the TM-7, 6EX and 7C FASST items. I will continue to watch this thread. If you need any additional information or assistance, please don't hesitate to inquire. I'd be glad to help.

Best regards,
Mark

Futaba 6EX, 7C and TM-7 Service Advisory-

"This service advisory affects only owners of the Futaba TM-7 module and 6EX and 7C FASST systems. Each FASST transmitter contains a unique eight digit identification code, programmed at the factory to identify the respective transmitter and to allow a receiver to be paired only to that radio’s signal. Recently we have learned that a very small number of the TM-7 modules, and 6EX and 7C FASST systems were incorrectly coded with a common code number during the manufacturing process. These units were subsequently sold prior to our awareness of the situation.

If two or more units, utilizing this common identification code, were to be in use simultaneously, they may cause interference with one another. Please note: Units which utilize the correct identification code will not be affected by these units.

We’re extremely confident that this is not a widespread problem. We know of only one instance in the United States. However, to give you peace of mind that your system is not affected, we will soon be setting up test stations at participating hobby shops throughout the country where you will be able to go to determine -- within a matter of minutes -- whether or not your transmitter is affected, at no charge to you. Or, if you prefer, you may send it in to our service center we will analyze it for you at no charge. If any problem is found, it will be replaced. We will gladly pay the postage for returning the unit and sending it back to you.

If you have questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact our Futaba Service Center at: 217-398-0007 or via email at: service@futaba-rc.com. Our staff is available to you Monday-Friday, 8am-5pm U.S. Central Standard Time.

Precautionary Measures and Information-

1) As with all radio control equipment, we strongly suggest that you pre-flight your aircraft thoroughly prior to flying. When flying at a location with other FASST owners, prior to flying we suggest that all pilots briefly activate their systems simultaneously to check for any interaction between units. If any interactions should occur, do NOT fly. Return the unit to the Futaba Service Center for immediate replacement.

2) Each time that your transmitter is turned on, it is imperative that you allow the FASST system an adequate amount of time to thoroughly boot-up completely before shutting down the transmitter. We recommend allowing the system at least five (5) seconds prior to turning off the power to the transmitter.

3) If the transmitter and receiver have lost their binding which required them to be re-linked, we recommend returning them to the Futaba Service Center for analysis. This is not expected behavior and should be investigated accordingly."

Here is some additional information that might prove useful for you as well:

We have performed literally hundreds of hours of testing on the Futaba FASST systems since this issue was reported to us. Thus far, we have NOT been able to negate the identification code in any of the transmitters that we have tested.

To be safe, however, we have inspected 100% of our inventory. All Futaba 6EX and 7C FASST transmitters, and TM-7 FASST transmitter modules shipped from our distribution center beginning Monday, January 14 and after, have been checked to insure that they do not contain the incorrectly coded identification.


Additionally, it is important to note that the TM-14 modules and transmitters with those modules are not affected.

[ConRadical]

Thanks for this information Mark!

[Kitman]

Thanks Mark for your insite.

[dick hanson]

	Quote: Originally Posted by GREAT PLANES
	Hi, All- Below you will find the 'official' Service Advisory pertaining to the TM-7, 6EX and 7C FASST items. I will continue to watch this thread. If you need any additional information or assistance, please don't hesitate to inquire. I'd be glad to help. Best regards, Mark Futaba 6EX, 7C and TM-7 Service Advisory- "This service advisory affects only owners of the Futaba TM-7 module and 6EX and 7C FASST systems. Each FASST transmitter contains a unique eight digit identification code, programmed at the factory to identify the respective transmitter and to allow a receiver to be paired only to that radio’s signal. Recently we have learned that a very small number of the TM-7 modules, and 6EX and 7C FASST systems were incorrectly coded with a common code number during the manufacturing process. These units were subsequently sold prior to our awareness of the situation. If two or more units, utilizing this common identification code, were to be in use simultaneously, they may cause interference with one another. Please note: Units which utilize the correct identification code will not be affected by these units. We’re extremely confident that this is not a widespread problem. We know of only one instance in the United States. However, to give you peace of mind that your system is not affected, we will soon be setting up test stations at participating hobby shops throughout the country where you will be able to go to determine -- within a matter of minutes -- whether or not your transmitter is affected, at no charge to you. Or, if you prefer, you may send it in to our service center we will analyze it for you at no charge. If any problem is found, it will be replaced. We will gladly pay the postage for returning the unit and sending it back to you. If you have questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact our Futaba Service Center at: 217-398-0007 or via email at: service@futaba-rc.com. Our staff is available to you Monday-Friday, 8am-5pm U.S. Central Standard Time. Precautionary Measures and Information- 1) As with all radio control equipment, we strongly suggest that you pre-flight your aircraft thoroughly prior to flying. When flying at a location with other FASST owners, prior to flying we suggest that all pilots briefly activate their systems simultaneously to check for any interaction between units. If any interactions should occur, do NOT fly. Return the unit to the Futaba Service Center for immediate replacement. 2) Each time that your transmitter is turned on, it is imperative that you allow the FASST system an adequate amount of time to thoroughly boot-up completely before shutting down the transmitter. We recommend allowing the system at least five (5) seconds prior to turning off the power to the transmitter. 3) If the transmitter and receiver have lost their binding which required them to be re-linked, we recommend returning them to the Futaba Service Center for analysis. This is not expected behavior and should be investigated accordingly." Here is some additional information that might prove useful for you as well: We have performed literally hundreds of hours of testing on the Futaba FASST systems since this issue was reported to us. Thus far, we have NOT been able to negate the identification code in any of the transmitters that we have tested. To be safe, however, we have inspected 100% of our inventory. All Futaba 6EX and 7C FASST transmitters, and TM-7 FASST transmitter modules shipped from our distribution center beginning Monday, January 14 and after, have been checked to insure that they do not contain the incorrectly coded identification. Additionally, it is important to note that the TM-14 modules and transmitters with those modules are not affected.

Precautionary measure , item 2
If you can - please enumerate the possible problems resulting from randomly switching power on and off.
I do not have a Futaba system but would like to know why this carefully structured ON/OFF procedure is necessary.
This "detail" is not required for other radios I have used in past or at present.

[Radioactive]

Hi Mark, Nice to see you!

[DA2000]

Dick,

PLEASE! Read the statement and the additional comments, it helps to remove the foil helmet!

We have performed literally hundreds of hours of testing on the Futaba FASST systems since this issue was reported to us. Thus far, we have NOT been able to negate the identification code in any of the transmitters that we have tested.


They have not been able to replicate the "switch bounce" themselves. But since they have heard second hand reports of it, they choose to add this as a precaution.

If any manufacturer had the policy of recalling a complete line of product after ANY person in the R/C community reported a glitch, we wouldn't have a hobby anymore.

Let them continue the testing, if they find a switching procedure that adversly affects the whole product line, I think they'll take care of it. Until that time, let's follow their recomendations and let others offline know about them.

[dick hanson]

	Quote: Originally Posted by DA2000
	Dick, PLEASE! Read the statement and the additional comments, it helps to remove the foil helmet! We have performed literally hundreds of hours of testing on the Futaba FASST systems since this issue was reported to us. Thus far, we have NOT been able to negate the identification code in any of the transmitters that we have tested. They have not been able to replicate the "switch bounce" themselves. But since they have heard second hand reports of it, they choose to add this as a precaution. If any manufacturer had the policy of recalling a complete line of product after ANY person in the R/C community reported a glitch, we wouldn't have a hobby anymore. Let them continue the testing, if they find a switching procedure that adversly affects the whole product line, I think they'll take care of it. Until that time, let's follow their recomendations and let others offline know about them.

I read the message and my comprehension is still pretty good
I asked why the procedure was required- I mentioned nothing about switch bounce
Simply "why is this procedure ( Precaution#2)important?"
Must I get permission to ask a simple question?

[sweetpea]

Mark--

As a CD I ask about #2 and #3.

What are the known effects or possible effects here.

Do I need to monitor these radios. I'm not as concerned if the problem is only restricted to their own plane but if there is a possiblity it could effect other planes flying FASST then I need to know for Freq conflicts.

[Julez]

	Quote:
	Thus far, we have NOT been able to negate the identification code in any of the transmitters that we have tested.

Well, two of three german users who let their batteries run down were affected.
I was actually the third one, and my radio simply lost its code after I switched it on exactly the same way as I did hundreds of times during the last 6 months.
Again, the main error is not that a radio has the ZGUID, but that it has the ability to get the ZGUID all by itself.
If this main error will not be corrected satisfactory, Futaba has a reputation to lose, as described here.
Weak phrases like "we are not able to reproduce the problem" simply won't cut it.
While it is nice to hear that the inventory wil be cleared of ZGUID TXes, this is not the main problem.
When XPS, Spektrum, and even ASSAN are able to keep their GUID, it would be very sad if Futaba was not able to manage the problem.
Who can guarantee me, that my TX will not lose its GUID the next time I switch it on, like id did yesterday evening? I would hate the thought that I would have to worry about each and every switching process.

[sweetpea]

My questions are valid no matter what radio I fly.

As the CD of an event I am responsible for Freq control. If FASST becomes more and more popular (which I'm sure it will)and I can't 100% put 2 planes in the air at the same time because I can't determine if they are zeros or not I need to know. It could restrict the number of entrants and flying time to a contest.



My question is with #2 and #3. Right now you are saying there could be a problem if these 2 conditions happen. What you are not saying is what the problem is or even might be.

So for the average flyer I cannot protect them from their own radio failing or interference outside of my control from bringing their airplane down. What I can control is freq conflicts so that one pilot does not inadvertantly (or on purpose) "shoot" another pilot down.

Since not every FASST owner will read this forum, your website or any other online forum I have to assume that FASST systems (models mentioned here) will have freq conflict. Since I will not have the equipment to test who has a Zguid and who doesn't I have to assume they all do. Even if I checked them prior to the contest you are now saying that with #2 and #3 there could be a problem with FASST but what?.....

My questions......

Is that problem radio specific (i.e radio loses programming modes etc)?
Is that problem the possiblity that it may Zguid and effect another user on Zguid?
Futaba is unsure of what exactly will happen during these #2 and #3?

Just to be fair......XPS/Spektrum have their own issues with planes falling out of the sky but they affect only the pilots plane. Not someone else flying. I won't restrict a specific brand radio....all flyers fly at their own risk of radio choice and install.
But they do expect some control over Freqs at a sanctioned event.


On another note....can you answer this about the other Futaba models on 72mhz w/ and without a 2.4 module.
Fast cycle of the 14/12mz's ........

what happens here?
-data lost to your radio but only affects your planes?
-do freqs reset or change?

Any other cause for concern to someone else's plane on 72mhz?

[Julez]

Sweetpea, you are exactly right.

In the same way, noone would allow a pilot to fly, if he does not know his channel.
Although the chances are only minimal, the only way to be 100% sure at this moment that a given number of Fasst systems do not affect each other, is to allow only one to operate at a time in the air.
Thats the sad truth.
I know you US guys have it with your lawsuits (please, no offense), but as the manager of an air show, I would carefully avoid any potential problems.

[Boulder]

Hey guys,

Let's keep this to the official statement and questions pertaining to that statement. I'm sure you will all agree that there are going to be questions after a statement by ANY manufacturer, so let's give the manufacturer time to respond. I'm sure Mark or another Futaba rep will respond in time...please be patient and give them a chance.

To be clear...ANY one can ask questions about this system, it doesn't matter what brand he or she flies. Dick's question was a logical one, one that I'm sure many would like the answer to.

50%,

There was nothing in your post, just didn't fit after I deleted the other ones.

Thank you guys a ton for helping us out on this one and not flaming anybody that has a question.

[ConRadical]

Guys...

I hate having to see posts deleted.

Lets do please keep this for information purposes only... No need to say anything to each other about who flies what radio... etc. Just keep in on track with information in mind. If someone asks a question how about let appropriate people, futaba/great planes, answer the questions.

[1bwana1]

Boulder/ConRadical,
Now that's the right attitude, Giants style.

Like I said on another thread, if the problem is limited to radios produced with a bad GUID, then Futabas current advisory, and remediation should be enough. On the other hand, if the GUID can somehow be reset by even the most unlikely user action, it is a whole different problem. The precautions in the advisory in this regard cause me concern, and Julez's report seems to add credibility to other reports on this problem. Julez, to be fair, are you working with Futaba to help them verify the reset ZGUID failure? If so, please let us know what you are doing, and how Futaba is responding. This would be very helpful to the community.

[Mithrandir]

I think the idea is for all the FASST 6 & 7 channel guys to do a little Pow-Wow at the event and just check their stuff t'gether... if during the event no one has a Re-Link occurrance..... there will be no problem. That is likely not intended to be a forever procedure.. but until everyone gets a grip on the technical issues.
At events that I run, I have everyone announce their name and frequency at the pilots meeting... then if there are two guys on the same channel.. they can see who each other is... simply another layer of protection in the process.

(These statements are just my own interpretation of the situation but in no way are intended to conflict with official FUTABA statements)

We are all friends here guys... I hate how this becomes divisive!