Problems!! 14MZ 2.4 R6014FS

[Kiwi]

Ron,

It is most likely all of them and its only a problem in models that heat up in the sun by the look of the reports. I have a pre production seven channel unit. It turns red at 160F on the case.

But the sky is not falling here. We flew these 14 channel and 7 channel units down here in our summer with no noticeable effect. Some days temps of 32 C in comp arf planes, large clear canopies. All the ingredients for a problem according to what we know here. In our case the Rx's are wrapped in HITEC Rx foam. Maybe its a good heat shield, maybe the planes here were in the shade when not flying. Lots and lots of maybes.

There are a ton of guys in Florida using them and no reports from there that I am aware of.

They are flying in jets with tail pipe temps of 600C only a foot or so away but there's lots of air movement in a jet so it does not seem to be an issue there either.

What does now seem pretty certain is the heat issue needs to be induced, its not produced from the receiver operating normally. The answer at the end of all this may be some simple precautions on installation and some kind of thermal protection.

The radio link is solid, its the environment that is the issue and that is also controllable.

There will be a fix for it without doubt and who nows it might be 20 cents worth of foam.

[dubd]

	Quote: Originally Posted by preston blake
	Just read this thread from beginning to end, all 22 pages. Found useful info on about a half dozen posts. We need need to have a separate place for people to whine and another place for people who just want to get the facts. The internet is an amazing place

And you created a post just to whine about the whiners. Funny stuff!

[madmax]

Gents, please don't make us get on the red mushroom button here. Keep this thread on topic, specifically about this issue. Take the "glad I bought blah blah" stuff elsewhere. Keeping our community informed is what we're about. Please don't make this suck.

Moving right along.

best-- MD

[Julez]

	Quote:
	But it failed really easily and even with the red light on you could hold it against your cheek and it was NOT HOT to touch.

Now this is strange.

When I heated up my 6ch RX, it really was very hot when it finally failed. I had to dangle it from the battery cable to avoid getting burned. Touching it was uncomfortable, and doing so for more than 0.5s was unbearable.

So either we have some rather high tolerances here (ISO9001, anyone), or the first series of recievers was somehow more robust.

Jürgen, you might want to post your AR6100 findings also over at RCG, if further testing shows they hold water.

Cheers,

Julez

[Kiwi]

Julez,

The amount of time and heat it took to knock over the Rx was amazingly small. Today if (I get permission from the big boss) I will place the Rx under a light to simulate the sun as opposed to blasting it with hot air. That way I can use a probe instead of that very very inaccurate laser temp gun. I say inaccurate because it only depends on the emissivity of the semi transparent plastic case. Unless you go to some good length to calibrate the device it can be 10 to 15 degrees out.

Using a slow bake (as has been done by others) genuinely tests the cut off temperature and should give a real reading.

I'm not sure I have the tools available or the time as I am off to the Joe Nall this week so time is precious. But if I can set up a controlled ambient of say 100F then maintain that (no glass house effect etc) and run the Rx loaded for say 30 minutes to see if it falls over. If what Jurgen says is correct then it should run at around about 110 F and there will be no problem. If that turns out to be correct then its a matter of protection and not function.

I mean as an example you dont leave your dog inside a closed car at the supermarket on a 110 F day. If you do your dogs dead. But then you dont blame the car manufacturer for a bad car design that killed your dog.

I think this is like the SPEKTRUM experience. They had a battle from the start with various issues all of which were overcome and today they are rock solid.

Anyway I'm off flying for the morning guys, FASST and all, no wind, 60 F outside and clear blue skies.

[as722]

Has futaba released any bulletins on this matter yet or are they saying there is no problem ?


Albert

[klhoard]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Kiwi
	. . <snip>. . I mean as an example you dont leave your dog inside a closed car at the supermarket on a 110 F day. If you do your dogs dead. But then you dont blame the car manufacturer for a bad car design that killed your dog.. . .<snip>. .

.
.
I can see the headline now:

Modeler arrested for animal cruelty - Caught chasing dog around back yard with heat gun and laser temp probe . . .
.
.

[japan3d]

It is Golden week in Japan right now, and most people are off for the whole week.

[Jurgen Heilig]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig
	Perhaps I should not have said anything? Went flying with my AcroMaster - AR6200 Spektrum rx. Drove home to solder a connector to a new Hacker/Flightpower 3s2500 pack, charged the battery and went back to the flying field. Left the model in the car for the whole time. Outside temperature approx. 22°C, but full sun. Back at the flying field, the AR6200 would not link to the tx - went straight into Smart Failsafe. That has never happened before. Back at home I re-checked and everything was working fine. I am puzzled. Jürgen

Did some temperature checks today. When I went for lunch, I left the Infrared-Thermometer in the glove compartment and it showed Error, beacause it got warmer than 40°C.

So I took it out and parked the car at the same location as yesterday. Air Temperature approx. 22°C. After 1.5 hours parked in the sun, the metallic grey paint of the car showed approx. 48°C, my blue jacket on the back seat showed 67°C and the dashboard was blistering 75°C hot.

Advise: Don't leave any temperature sensitive equipment in the car or baking in the sun.

Jürgen

[Jurgen Heilig]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Kiwi
	... I think this is like the SPEKTRUM experience. They had a battle from the start with various issues all of which were overcome and today they are rock solid. ...

Rock solid? A Spektrum at 100mW EU power has only half the range of a Futaba FASST on the same output power.

Even the latest AR 6100 v1.6 (with brownout-fix) takes up to 16 (sixteen) seconds to re-establish the link to the tx, after it goes into Failsafe.

The AR6200, 7000 and higher re-connect almost instantly.

Jürgen

[BR289]

One thing that would help and Futaba may have this idea already is a type of Data Log like the Spektrum unit.
After spending the last two days trying figure out some problems with my friends Spektrum set-up, I could see how helpful a similar Futaba unit would be...

[Judge]

	Quote: Originally Posted by as722
	Has futaba released any bulletins on this matter yet or are they saying there is no problem ? Albert

They have done neither. And apparently it is a big holiday week in Japan where mot people are off work. Not sure if Futaba canceled their holiday or not.

But again, Futaba is aware of the issue. Futaba is working on it, and they have not issued any advisory related to the heat issue.

And I guess I am a weenie. If I am in a position where it is so freaking hot out that I can overtemp my radio, well, I am generally inside with a cold one watching a game!!! Not a engineered solution, but my own personal operating procedure!!

[shogunmst]

Guess the new 10C 2.4 will have the same problem since they also use the same receiver.... I'll wait to see what happens before I replace my ole trusty 9C Super....

[Mode1Mike]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Judge
	They have done neither. And apparently it is a big holiday week in Japan where mot people are off work. Not sure if Futaba canceled their holiday or not. But again, Futaba is aware of the issue. Futaba is working on it, and they have not issued any advisory related to the heat issue. And I guess I am a weenie. If I am in a position where it is so freaking hot out that I can overtemp my radio, well, I am generally inside with a cold one wathing a game!!! Not a engineered solution, but my own personal operating procedure!!

Judge

Are you an official representative of Futaba and spokesman?

[Kiwi]

Well it seems to get interesting if you look around and find the operational limits of most of the gadgets you use daily and some that you would call critical.

I'n not going to fill this post up with other similar item specs but my hunt using google on common brand products shows some very startling information.

Take our faithful iPhone for example.

Environmental requirements
Operating temperature: 32° to 95° F (0° to 35° C)
Nonoperating temperature: -4° to 113° F (-20° to 45° C)
Relative humidity: 5% to 95% noncondensing
Maximum operating altitude: 10,000 feet (3000 m)

Go have a look around at the other critical items you use with great faith every day. In fact it seems that if the FASST limit is 155 F then its actually a very sturdy piece of equipment and has a higher tolerance level than most other consumer electronics.

Now I'm not saying that good or bad for FASST but it does seem that it operates above the norm.

So could it possibly be that this operational issue sets a new level of acceptance for this consumer electronic device?? One that exceeds what was a totally acceptable standard before.!!!