Aeroworks 150cc Ultimate

[Galaxy 3D]

Well I just got back from my second day out with my heavy pig of an Ultimate. One think is for sure the 220 has a ton of power. At 50lbs it pulls out of a hover with authority and accelerates upward. I am however having radio problems. The first day out I used my new JR 12X on PCM and got several lock outs during flight. I changed the radio to my 10X that is on 6 Meters and it did better, but I still had one 10 second lock out at the end of the day. I am starting to think that I am getting allot of RF noise to the servos because I am running my Power Box at 7.2V instead of 6. I think I am just going to switch to 2.4. I just do not want to run a bunch of Y harnesses for my servo set up, and I would like to run the servos at 7V.

If I could get the weight down I know it would fly so much better. At this weight it IMACS very well, but it suffers allot at high alpha maneuvers. I am also getting allot of wing flex, and it is a bit scary. I have one of the early Aero Works 260s that had the week wings and I lost an airplane because of that. I am contemplating adding flying wires to get rid of the high flexing. Over all I am happy with the airplane, but I am just disappointed in the weight.

[MikeC3D]

I would look at your options for losing weight from it instead of wires. JMO

[Galaxy 3D]

	Quote: Originally Posted by MikeC3D
	I would look at your options for losing weight from it instead of wires. JMO

Dude you make no since. I suppose you use 26G wire for your gear.

No matter what you guys say there is NO way I added 11lbs of weight to my airplane. My engine is only 4lbs heavier than the average 150cc set up, and my so called extra gear is measured in oz not pounds. I believe there is at least a 5lb weight deviation in the airframes Aero Works sells. I have been in this hobby for over 25yrs and I have been operating UAVs and unmanned airships for the last 15yrs. So I think I am qualified to judge the weight differences of ARFs out there. I know I will get some wise ass responses, but I can care less. I just wanted to post some REAL information about a product I purchased and tested. So fire away at my 2lb servos and 1lb per foot super heavy wire.

[gapple12]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Galaxy 3D
	Dude you make no since. I suppose you use 26G wire for your gear. No matter what you guys say there is NO way I added 11lbs of weight to my airplane. My engine is only 4lbs heavier than the average 150cc set up, and my so called extra gear is measured in oz not pounds. I believe there is at least a 5lb weight deviation in the airframes Aero Works sells. I have been in this hobby for over 25yrs and I have been operating UAVs and unmanned airships for the last 15yrs. So I think I am qualified to judge the weight differences of ARFs out there. I know I will get some wise ass responses, but I can care less. I just wanted to post some REAL information about a product I purchased and tested. So fire away at my 2lb servos and 1lb per foot super heavy wire.

Hey, all that matters is that your happy and enjoying your plane. I WOULD recommend going to 2.4 if you are getting an kind of hits. Just to much money to take the chance. Have fun.........

Drew

[BigBird]

5 lbs devation in airframes? I guess this might happen if the production line used rock hard maple instead of light ply.
All the "extra" stuff you have in that airplane is why your are so heavy. Don't care who made the airplane the outcome will always be the same when you bolt that much equipment in.
It is clear you don't trust us and that is fine. Just taking out the power box and the two extra rudder servos would make a huge change in AUW.
Jason D.

[Galaxy 3D]

	Quote: Originally Posted by BigBird
	5 lbs devation in airframes? I guess this might happen if the production line used rock hard maple instead of light ply. All the "extra" stuff you have in that airplane is why your are so heavy. Don't care who made the airplane the outcome will always be the same when you bolt that much equipment in. It is clear you don't trust us and that is fine. Just taking out the power box and the two extra rudder servos would make a huge change in AUW. Jason D.

Again you make no since. You mean to tell me I will magically lose up to 5lbs by removing 2 servos ( which comes out to 6oz and yes that includes the aluminum arms and linkages) and a power box that adds a walloping 5oz!! Its comments like this that are asinine. With a 42% scale airframe it is VERY possible to add extra weight if there is no quality control in the wood that is used. Just ask any Pro builder out there.

[BigBird]

	Quote: Originally Posted by Galaxy 3D
	Again you make no since. You mean to tell me I will magically lose up to 5lbs by removing 2 servos ( which comes out to 6oz and yes that includes the aluminum arms and linkages) and a power box that adds a walloping 5oz!! Its comments like this that are asinine. With a 42% scale airframe it is VERY possible to add extra weight if there is no quality control in the wood that is used. Just ask any Pro builder out there.

I never said you would take out 5 pounds by removing the servos and power box. Just stating that you could get the weight down from where you are at now.

How much weight did you add back in with the firewall and engine ducting relocation? If you don't know then you were not worried about weight.

Basicly what the guys are stating is you have to worry about weight every step of the way. And yes it does add up. Take it however you want but this approach works no matter what.
Will there be a weight diffrence between bare airframe to bare airframe? Of course but not 5 pounds. I hope you have fun with the airplane but be sure and put flying wires on it at 50 pounds the wings will be crying without some help.
Jason

[Galaxy 3D]

	Quote: Originally Posted by BigBird
	I never said you would take out 5 pounds by removing the servos and power box. Just stating that you could get the weight down from where you are at now. How much weight did you add back in with the firewall and engine ducting relocation? If you don't know then you were not worried about weight. Basicly what the guys are stating is you have to worry about weight every step of the way. And yes it does add up. Take it however you want but this approach works no matter what. Will there be a weight diffrence between bare airframe to bare airframe? Of course but not 5 pounds. I hope you have fun with the airplane but be sure and put flying wires on it at 50 pounds the wings will be crying without some help. Jason

I did not add any weight relocating the firewall. I had to remove 3 inches of material and I used the original firewall plate. All I added was some fiberglass cloth the reinforce the firewall, and that additional weight is canceled out by the material I removed. The baffling is made of light plywood. The material and screws only come out at 4.6oz (lighter than my Power Box).

I am sorry but 5lbs is very possible and most likely to happen without material quality control. Again ask anyone who builds theses airplanes them selves. I know from experience that you can shave more than 8lbs from an airplane this size by using competition grade wood. I am not saying that Aero Works is not a good brand of they do not make quality airplanes, but for the money we spend on these ARFs and the level some pilots want to fly these things, I thing there should be higher standards for their building material. As everyone knows weight is a very important standard when it comes to these high performance aircraft.

[Showtime]

Mine has a very similar set up and it weighs 45.9 pounds. I used 3 servos in tail and the PB champion rrs. one gas tank and my baffling is made of Honey comb. Which is light as hell. I am not using a spinner but i did remove the floor were the radio Shiz was going to be....... saved 4oz or so. I am thinking of also removing the tunnel for the full lengths canisters that i am not going to use cause my canisters are short.... I shouild be able to get this thing down to 44lb or so,,,, we will see pictures are coming soon.

[Galaxy 3D]

I am flush with envy. With that engine at 44lbs you will diffidently have a winner. Thats a good idea for the tunnels. I might do that too.

[MikeC3D]

[quote=Galaxy 3D;768330]Dude you make no since. I suppose you use 26G wire for your gear.


I was refering to the flying wires dude...but you clearly dont want the opinions or advice that you are asking for. With the knowledge that you claim to posses, one would thing your knowledge would allow you to aseemble a lighter setup, or you could just build one from a kit or scratch. You also show a smoke set up in your pics, thats generaly 2-2 1/2# also, plus 4# more for your engine choice. And most of these guys you are talking to are exprienced builders and have offered sound advice. Take it how you will, but dont blame AW or the factory when your wings fold up and destroy all of your equipment.

JD post a pic of your weight when its done.....

[dubd]

You say your engine weighs 4 pounds more than a DA, so how much weight did you add to the tail to get it to balance?

[bodywerks]

it weighs over 4 pounds more than a 170 - he has a 4 cylinder engine. he is running two additional servos in the tail.

[Galaxy 3D]

I did not add any weight to get the CG right. I am running 4 rudder servos in the tail and I mounted the receiver batteries in the rear section of the turtle deck.

[Jason Noll]

Ok, now I'm calling you out on this one!

I have two here, and I have flown a third one out here in Denver that Mark Dennis has and the all way under 40 lbs!!!! I know it's a biplane and all and your instinct is to want to say it's heavy, but its not by any means.

I told you that your weight was an issue with the wings. My suggestion!, start all over with a DA-170! Its hard to argue with the facts here. Put flying wires on it if you want, still to damn heavy!

JN