30% TOC wont hover.

[borealnw]

I know when you first looked at the thread heading you thought another newbie with not enough practice. Well this is deff the plane.

Plane 30% TOC yak 54
Engine DLE-55
Servo's hitech 7985's all around 7965 throttle and JR 8711 rudder
Prop Vess 23A
Weight dry is 17 1/2 pounds Full 18 1/4

CG is set just a little to the back. Another words in inverted 45 it climbs slightly.

Surfaces Elev endpoints at 45* Ail 40* Rudder 40*
TX high rates Expo at 80

Modes I've already done.

Mounted the fuel tank 24 oz. under the wing tube in the canister tunnel.

Ok I have a few mixes for knife edge both ways clean and stable. All summer I've been fighting this plane in a hover. Today I let two of the hover veterans fly it and low and behold they could not get it to hover either. ( and these guys are the best I've ever seen at hover)

Problem The plane is very unstable at any latitude and throttle position. As long as it is climbing slightly then it locks in but as soon as you lower it to drop the plane or hold it on one postition it leans to the wheels. At least 3/4 on the elevator to hold it for half second then pump on the elev to correct. We pitched it back and it holds a second then falls out.

I oraganally set up the plane for IMAC but it will soon be replaced with a larger plane so I thought set this one up for 3D and freestyle and huck it. That said I had to add 5 ounce of weight to the nose to get it to balance at CG stated above. It flies IMAC on rails right thrust is just a little out so I need to give it a little on upline entry. Anyway everything in the kit is stock Alum LG, wing a stab tubes.

Any ideas?? Some think it is a thrust issue another said to take out the 5 ounce of weight. I can fix a thrust issue but would like to keep the CG where it is in case I need a IMAC back up.

[srm 99]

	Quote: Originally Posted by borealnw
	I know when you first looked at the thread heading you thought another newbie with not enough practice. Well this is deff the plane. Plane 30% TOC yak 54 Engine DLE-55 Servo's hitech 7985's all around 7965 throttle and JR 8711 rudder Prop Vess 23A Weight dry is 17 1/2 pounds Full 18 1/4 CG is set just a little to the back. Another words in inverted 45 it climbs slightly. Surfaces Elev endpoints at 45* Ail 40* Rudder 40* TX high rates Expo at 80 Modes I've already done. Mounted the fuel tank 32 oz. under the wing tube in the canister tunnel. Ok I have a few mixes for knife edge both ways clean and stable. All summer I've been fighting this plane in a hover. Today I let two of the hover veterans fly it and low and behold they could not get it to hover either. ( and these guys are the best I've ever seen at hover) Problem The plane is very unstable at any latitude and throttle position. As long as it is climbing slightly then it locks in but as soon as you lower it to drop the plane or hold it on one postition it leans to the wheels. At least 3/4 on the elevator to hold it for half second then pump on the elev to correct. We pitched it back and it holds a second then falls out. I oraganally set up the plane for IMAC but it will soon be replaced with a larger plane so I thought set this one up for 3D and freestyle and huck it. That said I had to add 5 ounce of weight to the nose to get it to balance at CG stated above. It flies IMAC on rails right thrust is just a little out so I need to give it a little on upline entry. Anyway everything in the kit is stock Alum LG, wing a stab tubes. Any ideas?? Some think it is a thrust issue another said to take out the 5 ounce of weight. I can fix a thrust issue but would like to keep the CG where it is in case I need a IMAC back up.

i would say drop some weight a 32 oz tank wow that be the first thing to toss get a 16 oz tank and locate it above the canister tunnel as u want to balance laturaly
I had a SD witch is the same as a TOC 30% and i found if your to tail heavy its a prick to hover always wanted to move out from a hover and whats your thrust line set at .

heres a video of mine a mate showing what it can do sorry for the quality it was a while ago

YouTube - yak

[adrian]

hovered mine all day long|!!!!

[SmoothFlying]

Is it the plane will not stay in a hover because of lack of power or is it just falling out and not staying in a hover. I'm not downing your skills or anything but try and find someone who can hover real well and let them have a try at it. I think with that setup the plane should hover just like Adrians.

[coptered]

It sounds like a thrust line issue. I had an SD Yak that had too much down thrust. Once I shimmed the engine up and got the thrust line right it seemed to lock into a hover much better. Have you performed a thrust line check in straight and level flight?

Eddie

[JoeAirPort]

That fuel tank holds a pound of fuel you don't need and will totally make it balance nose heavy when full. That would be the first change I'd make. Go to a 16 oz tank. 20 oz is the absolute max but with 3D you'll still land with a half tank for 10 minute flights. You could just put 16 oz of fuel in your 32 oz tank to test this. 16 oz is about 52 turns of my fuel filler pump.

Now that I think about it your empty and full weight don't make sense. The tank holds two pounds of fuel.

[Extra nuts]

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[Extra nuts]

	Quote: Originally Posted by coptered
	It sounds like a thrust line issue. I had an SD Yak that had too much down thrust. Once I shimmed the engine up and got the thrust line right it seemed to lock into a hover much better. Have you performed a thrust line check in straight and level flight? Eddie

Do your thrustline checks on vertical downlines with power back and at 45's and see if the plane pulls or pushes off the heading.

	Quote: Originally Posted by JoeAirPort
	That fuel tank holds a pound of fuel you don't need and will totally make it balance nose heavy when full. That would be the first change I'd make. Go to a 16 oz tank. 20 oz is the absolute max but with 3D you'll still land with a half tank for 10 minute flights. You could just put 16 oz of fuel in your 32 oz tank to test this. 16 oz is about 52 turns of my fuel filler pump. Now that I think about it your empty and full weight don't make sense. The tank holds two pounds of fuel.

If your fuel tank is under the wingtube, there should not be any change in CG whether it is fulll or empty. Move your CG as far back as you can for better hovering. If your plane pitches toward the gear side, move your thrust line up. Also check your incidences and decalage. Also make sure your ailerons are not down at nuetral working like flaps. Make your elevators, ailerons line up with the stabs and wings. Then adjust by moving the cg and engine thrustline.

[sinergy]

If it climbs in a 45 inverted line you are too tail heavy. Make it hold the line and you are much closer.

That being said you don't need a plane to be majorly tail heavy to 3D, thats all Internet hype. I 3D mine planes when they are setup for IMAC and they all drop the nose fairly quickly on an inverted 45.

The more tail heavy you get the worse they perform in all other aspects outside of tumbling.


Before you waste your time on thrust you have to get the CG right or you will just continue to chase your tail...

[3dAndrew]

As said earlier in the thread, get rid of the 32oz tank, that thing is BIG! i am running a 32oz in my 33%cap, but i am running the stock 18oz fuel tank in my 30% yak, with a da50 on stock muffler, 7955's on the elevators and 1-7955on the rudder, then 2 5645's on the ailerons. I can hover it as long as i want, but don't hover much any more as it is truly what EVERYONE IS TRYING TO DO, ooooh hover this hover that.........it gets boring after a while, no offense i still do it and all because it looks cool, but don't hover a whole flight.... but it sounds like you have a setup issue. I think it might be some of your mixes, because it sounds like you used alot of mixing....i have ZERO mixing, and only 30% expo on high rate elevator, my expo is at 0 for everything else. So i think its a setup issue and probably a "thrust-line" issue. I remember my yak needed some more thrust on the bottom right side. And then it was ALL GOOD! So YES its a SETUP issue. Definately not your flying skills especially if you had 2 others try it and they couldn't do it. So good luck and please post pictures of your set-up that would probably help people out.... Good luck and take care!

[3ddd]

reread,,he said 24 oz tank and yes you are too tail heavy,inverted 45 upline, just breath on the stick to maintain and you will be right

[borealnw]

Yeah sorry about the typo on the fuel tank it was late and I said the wrong numbers LOL. It is a 24 ounce tank was given to me at a IMAC meet when mine busted at the seem. Came from a 35% Hanger 9 260. Anyway it was only 4 Ounce larger so I did not see the harm. Anyway I am starting to rethink that and will find a 16-20 ounce tank to place in the plane.

Ok straight and level the plane has a tendency to climb, just enough to add on click of down trim. In inverted 45* downline it falls to the canopy so I mixed in less elev trim at idle. Also left knife edge it couples hard to the canopy and right knife edge it couples to the wheels. So again I mixed in a elev to rudder -10 on left and -12 on right with -3 on ail left and 2 on ail right. Again I have the CG set at neutral inverted. But after chatting with some that went to TAS they all came back saying make it nose heavey just a smidgen. So this is where I was going next. Then redo all the trims and mixes.

It pulls a little left on uplines so I know I need a little right thrust. I will check the up and down this week. Will also post some pics. Thanks for the input.

Also is it that critikle to place the tank above in the fuse. I've read so many thread where folks placed them lower under the wing tube to maintain a constant CG. I

[Show871]

You need a hover button, they are handy

[Flatlandman]

What are the end points on your throttle and what prop are you running?

Edit ok i reread your first post vess 23a. Still, what end points?

[Flatlandman]

After some more rereading of your post your expos are to high

adjust your high rate expos to

ele 45
rudder 40
ailer 50