XFC scores!!!

[falconpilot]

Sorry,

My mistake, and I also said sorry to Frank and Jason above, as I assumed that Frank was judging from the post above, but see that someone was referring to "two family members,and politic's"...Assuming makes an ASS of me!! Jim

I'm not qualified to judge the XFC nor would I want to...These guys are all so close in skill, it would be tough...Judging is SUBJECTIVE no matter how you look at it. The best a judge can do is to know ALL the rules, be subjective/objective, and try not be influenced by any outside factors!!

[Wayne]

Ahh...

isnt the internet great??

[Kevin Y]

Falconpilot Frank was not Judging at the XFC, he was one many behind the scenes making sure the event ran smoothly.

Jason, congratulations on your win!

Ok this is my take, when I first arrived at the XFC I expected to see some hardcore on the deck flying but I was suprised to see that kind of flying was not scoring as well. After looking back at the whole weekend I really feel that the judges were looking for a "precision 3D". They seemed to be looking for not so much the jamming sticks and sitting there torque rolling that gets the crowd going but flying to the music, hitting all your points, constantly doing something, and things like that. It almost was like a 3D event judged like an IMAC contest.

I have a feeling this is going to be a new trend that we are going to see, I would almost bet that the masters will be judged very similar. I would have liked to see Andrew Jesky place higher, he flew spectacular but it did not seem to wow the judges which suprises me because I think he did everything I described. I do think that it will be a good thing for Andrew and the other Masters pilots because now they know what to expect in the masters, basically like a tune up game for them.

[falconpilot]

Again,

As posted above....I apologize to Frank and Jason about the mistake...All the same, the made points apply to the judging.....We're all human and all see things different for others...Jim

[GremlinX]

Congrats.... Jason . He is not a hack pilot . I did not see anything from XFC, but I don't need to have seen anything there to know he is good, along with the other top 10. Sometimes what does or does not dazzle the crowd may or may not be the right thing. When a race car crashes and keeps going, the crowd goes wild. Was a crash a good thing? No, but it was entertaining. Poor analogy, but you see what I mean. We all have our favorites, so keep it clean... my 2 cents...

[adrian]

[WOODisGOOD]

	Quote: Originally Posted by falconpilot
	First all, congrad's to all who flew in the XFC, and to Jason for the win..They ALL sent lots of TIME, MONEY,and PRATICE to get there! I've been brooding on this subject since last years Nats. As many know, last year Baron Johnson beat out Mark in the freestyle, and Baron father, Freddie Johnson was a judge.

I was not at last years nats but its my understanding that Barons dad calls for Baron and did not judge the freestyle event nor has he judged Baron at any event that Baron has flown in. I have been at several contests that Baron has attended and not once has Fred or Julie ( Barons mom ) judged him.

As for the XFC, congratulations to Jason and all of the pilots who competed. I agree to the points made in a earlier post that the freestyle judgeing seems to be more precision than just the wow factor. When I say this I mean that when a pilot is flying his freestyle that it appears to the judge that at no time is the pilot out of control and that he is placeing his manuvers exactly where he wants them. Also things such as point rolls. If a pilot is doing a 8 point roll to music, is he hitting his points accurately like he would in a precision sequence or is it just 8 times that the pilot stopped rotation of the plane during a roll.

[wmat7039]

	Quote: Originally Posted by falconpilot
	Again, As posted above....I apologize to Frank and Jason about the mistake.....Jim

Sir.... You not only need to apologize to Frank & Jason, BUT you also (out of principle!) NEED to.....HAVE TO.... apologize to both Fred & Baron Johnson for your GROSS mistake!

Having been involved with IMAC Aerobatics extensively, I MUST advise you that neither Fred nor Julie have judged Baron at a contest. That is a FACT!

Firstly, Fred calls for Baron.....
Secondly, because the Johnson family has high principles, they have always excused themselves from being in the judging seat in those circumstances.

It would be MUCH better to check facts BEFORE hitting the send key! It can save a lot of grief.
Wayne Matthews
IMAC SE Judging Instructor

[bodywerks]

	Quote: Originally Posted by merlin3
	I agree that gernot had some amazing flights and I'm glad that he placed so high but to be honest once again I think quique was robbed again just like in the etoc and it's starting to just become a little ridiculous. Two of the judges were from the same family which should not happen. Oh well at least scott gray won, he was flying great and his dad doesn't even run the event.

I do have to say that the judges are looking for way different things than we are. As spectators we all get excited over stuff when it gets REAL low - the judges don't care how high you are. Then we go crazy when we see the pilot exhibitting phenominal control while only inches off the deck - again, the judges don't care. They are looking for timing with the music, mixing up the speed of the music and flying and unique maneuvers/tricks. If a pilot knows this stuff to a tee, it's like points on a video game: if you know how to score the points and do it often, you get the high score. I am sure that on a critical standpoint, Jason had the points thing figured out. But if they accounted for crowd applause or ballot voting, he probably wouldn't have done as well. But they don't do that so congradulations Jason!

[merlin3]

I was actually rooting for jason on friday and saturday because he did so well with the music but his flights on sunday were just not there. His known routine looked no where near as good as some of the other competitors. sure I'm not a judge but I stll know what the diamond and the square should look like. Here's a question. What's the name of the contest?, and are point rolls for an entire routine extreme?

[Kevin Y]

the only thing I would have like to see would have been the finalists start from zero and not carry there best round from the previous day. I think some felt that they were out of it before they even flew there final rounds.

[Kevin Y]

	Quote: Originally Posted by merlin3
	Here's a question. What's the name of the contest?, and are point rolls for an entire routine extreme?

I think the best thing to do is just to say it was not your prefered style of 3D before this blows out to be a bigger arguement then it already is.

I am not trying to pic on you here but I do think that the point rolls help, they keep the routine flowing and keep your attention, instead of just level flight.

[Craven]

I was there all 3 days and all I can say is I think ALL the judges did one hell of a job! That's not an easy 3 days of work!

[EXTREME FLIGHT]

Several pages of judging criteria are sent to each pilot well in advance of the contest, along with the 3 required maneuvers which must be present in the known routine. The pilots who follow this judging criteria will receive the highest scores. No where in the criteria is it mentioned that additional points will be awarded for excessively low, risky flying. Jason is one of the most aggressive pilots I have ever seen. I have seen him do things that make me gasp and he is certainly as capable as anyone of flying extremely aggressive 3D. But that is not what scores well at this contest. Jason followed the judging guidelines to a "t", and as a result he won. Don't belittle him or his win because of this.
The Masters is an entirley different format. Pilots fly known and unknown precision sequences as well as a freestyle.

[Biff]

Guys, this thread is going South fast. Some of the posts here do not belong on the Flying Giants. The criteria were clearly spelled out. Wanna have your opinion make a difference? Set on the flight line for 3 days. The real politics are happening on the net, not on the flightline. Drop the attitude. I truly would hate to lock this thread down, but I find some posts rude. The Flying Giants will not be a part of adding to the worst part of our hobby.