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Old 10-12-2008, 08:37 AM
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Re: Our future....????

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Yup! Its true- Ninety-five percent of democrats give the rest a bad name.
I'll have to remember that one!
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Old 10-12-2008, 09:04 AM
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This was amazing. I've heard of her before, but thought she was just a raging feminist. Well, whether or not she is, she is milfalicious, and intelligent, and has a hell of a rack- not to mention she is bringing all of the "conspiracy theories" to light, and EVERYTHING she says can be verified.

This is 27 minutes long, so go refill your coffee and prepare to go WTF. I'm sure many of you will call BS, but google anything she says. I have already checked around 70% of it and its reliable. I don't see her as a mouthpiece for the lunatic fringe, but I do see her as a threat to the administration, so she may well be silenced soon. Somehow.

Scary business here, folks.

TalkingStickTV - Naomi Wolf - Give Me Liberty (27 min 53 sec)
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Old 10-12-2008, 09:27 AM
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Re: Our future....????

Yep..i would tag her......again!!!
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Old 10-12-2008, 09:31 AM
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Re: Our future....????

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3D Meatshield View Post
This was amazing. I've heard of her before, but thought she was just a raging feminist. Well, whether or not she is, she is milfalicious, and intelligent, and has a hell of a rack- not to mention she is bringing all of the "conspiracy theories" to light, and EVERYTHING she says can be verified.

This is 27 minutes long, so go refill your coffee and prepare to go WTF. I'm sure many of you will call BS, but google anything she says. I have already checked around 70% of it and its reliable. I don't see her as a mouthpiece for the lunatic fringe, but I do see her as a threat to the administration, so she may well be silenced soon. Somehow.

Scary business here, folks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XgkeTanCGI

Just watched it. So far, everything that I can find to verify her words has come out PRECISELY as she said it would.

http://www.militarytimes.com/forum/s....php?t=1568518

Truly frightening.

Scott
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Old 10-12-2008, 09:41 AM
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Re: Our future....????

While Acorn certainly has some responsibility, you're really going to blame the meltdown, credit crisis, and resultant market slide on one group, one party, or a homeowner demographic? At least listen to this link

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/Radi...px?episode=365

It is the best non-partisan (if that's possible in these vitriolic partisan times) description of the crisis that I've been able to find.

Based on what I've found and quoted from a well informed colleague:

"1. There was a lot of cash world-wide (in the hands of companies, pension funds, hedge funds, and other large investors) and the holders of that cash wanted to find a safe, short-term place to keep it - like a money-market fund but with a little bit better interest rate and a little bit longer time commitment. 2. Our government de-regulated some of our banking-type institutions, including brokerages houses, and increased their ability to deal in complex financial instruments. 3. Some bright guys devised a way to take a group of mortgages and bundle them together to make a security (sorta like a GNMA fund), but with the kicker that these instruments would trade frequently and like a short-term investment. They called them Collateralized Mortgage Obligations (CMOs), meaning the collateral for these securities was based on home mortgages, which everyone knew were very safe. 4. The real estate market kept rising. 5. Mortgage banks found out they could make a mortgage and then bundle it together with other mortgages and sell them to the bright guys (who used them for CMOs) for a nice profit. They could re-sell all the mortgages they could write, so they became unconcerned with the ability of the buyer to make payment - they weren't holding the mortgages for long and rising real estate prices were masking people's inability to afford the houses. 5. The real estate market stopped going up, and started sliding. 6. These "safe" CMOs began to look risky, and people started to default on their mortgages. 7. No one wanted to buy CMOs - the market for them stopped dead, frozen even though a market for them had been promised when the bright guys sold them to the big investors. Banks were left holding their most recent mortgages (think IndyMac), and the big investors couldn't touch their money because no one would take the CMOs at any price. They do have value - not everyone is going to default on their mortgage, and the houses are still there, just not worth as much as before. 8. The accounts had to make the financial statements, and the FASB requires investments to be listed on the balance sheet at market value - but what was the value if nothing traded at any price? When the big mortgage lenders did their financial statements and wrote down the value of the loans, they found that they were in violation of government rules about how much capital they were required to hold if they took deposits from people. This brought the IndyMacs to bankruptcy, and others to merge with stronger partners. 9. Panic spread - our banking system is the life-blood of our economy - and all the credit markets were affected. Money is not moving right now, no borrowing or lending. 10. The government decided to "bail-out" the situation. In essence the government will buy the mortgages at a set price, and now the accountants (for the banks, pension funds, global companies, etc.) will have a reasonable price to use to value the assets on their balance sheet, and some of the banks will stay solvent because they got rid of their riskiest holdings. The hope is that once trading starts again, even with the government as the buyer, the credit markets will unfreeze."

Obviously, the credit market didn't completely unfreeze, and due to the resultant panic that has gripped the market, it continues to slide as people cut losses and retrench in cash. Take it or leave it. No one party is immune from blame, nor is any one person or group solely responsible. To state such is absurd.

Scott
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Old 10-12-2008, 09:55 AM
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Re: Our future....????

I dont blame Obama for the mortgage problems. I do have fundamental problems with Obama and the associations he has made. Like I said in an earlier post, he probably would not make a huge impact on this country because he has a history of doing nothing. There is nothing he has done that benefits the country in his term as a senator and his record is consistent with that. I dont know that he has done anything this hurts the country...again...he has done nothing as a U.S. Senator except run for President and vote present. I listen to FOX news because they actually report things the other stations will obviously not report. the ABC (All Barak Channel) for what ever reason will not report his affiliations or even question anything he has done wrong.

Congress is where the power is. We need a push to sweep out Congress and get new faces in there. The people have power too. We need to use it...Tell our Congressman that we want term limitations and no more career politicians. If we truely want a sound government that is in the best interest of the people...that is what we need to do.
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Old 10-12-2008, 10:07 AM
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Re: Our future....????

Quote:
Originally Posted by sukhoi26mx View Post

Obviously, the credit market didn't completely unfreeze, and due to the resultant panic that has gripped the market, it continues to slide as people cut losses and retrench in cash. Take it or leave it. No one party is immune from blame, nor is any one person or group solely responsible. To state such is absurd.

Scott
So true, man, so true. Both parties are equally at blame here, for differing reasons across the economic meltdown.

What people need to realize first and foremost is that the partisan system we now have isn't there so much to have two distinct political parties, with differing ideologies, but more so to keep the populace divided ideologically- therefore to keep the people from uniting as one to overthrow the demagogues who have usurped the people's authority.

By keeping the people entrenched in partisan politics, it's like having half the country rooting for OSU and the other half rooting for Michigan- they will NEVER unite as one. The people as a whole need to realize this, and get past the partisan crap that is destroying our country. We all need to come together, put the petty differences aside, and unite in our desire for real change. Get almost ALL of the scumbags out of office, and start from scratch. (There actually are a few stand-up people in congress but they are the minority exception, most certainly not the rule.)
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Old 10-12-2008, 11:33 AM
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Re: Our future....????

Few things I found out this week.........I have yet to fact check them so if anyone else can verify before me great!

1. Obama has 3.3 million in campaign funds by non US address that are over the $200 non disclosure limit. It is ok to take money from non US address's as long as that person is still a resisdent of the US. Also he does have numerous $200 contributions that he has not divulged from who. Word is those funds are under investigation. McCain has every dollar donated listed on his website...including those under $200


2. I'm really not sure about this one........it really needs to be checked out.

*This has been flying under the radar. The MSNBC article a I pasted the TorF version 1 below. IF event is factual. I have a renewed respect for President Bush. He has taken the heat
of being called a liar and a war monger for 5 years while he kept his
silence to protect the people of the world. This is truly a display of
selfless honor.*

On July 5, 2008, the Associated Press (AP) released a story titled: Secret
U.S. mission hauls uranium from Iraq. The opening paragraph is as follows:

The last major remnant of Saddam Hussein's nuclear program a huge stockpile
of concentrated natural uranium reached a Canadian port Saturday to complete
a secret U.S. operation that included a two week airlift from Baghdad and a
ship voyage crossing two oceans.

See anything wrong with this picture? We have been hearing from the far-left
for more than five years how, Bush lied. Somehow, that slogan loses its
credibility now that 550 metric tons of Saddam's yellowcake, used for
nuclear weapon enrichment, has been discovered and shipped to Canada for its
new use as nuclear energy.

It appears that American troops found the 550 metric tons of uranium in 2003
after invading Iraq. They had to sit on this information and the uranium
itself, for fear of terrorists attempting to steal it. It was guarded and
kept safe by our military in a 23,000-acre site with large sand beams
surrounding the site.

This is vindication for the Bush administration, having been attacked
mercilessly by the liberal media and the far-left pundits on the
blogosphere. Now that it is proven that President Bush did not lie about
Saddam's nuclear ambitions, one would think the mainstream media would
report the story. Once the AP released the story, the mainstream media
should have picked it up and broadcast it worldwide.

This never happened, due in large part I believe, to the fact that the
mainstream media would have to admit they were wrong about Bush's war
motives all along. Thankfully, the AP got it right when it said, The removal
of 550 metric tons of yellowcake the seed material for higher-grade nuclear
enrichment was a significant step toward closing the books on Saddam's
nuclear legacy.

Closing the book on Saddam's nuclear legacy. Did Saddam have a nuclear
legacy after all? I thought Bush lied. As it turns out, the people who lied
were Joe Wilson and his wife.

Valerie Plame engaged in a clear case of nepotism and convinced the CIA to
send her husband on a fact finding mission in February
2002, seeking to determine if Saddam Hussein attempted to buy yellowcake
from Niger. The CIA and British intelligence believed Saddam contacted Niger
for that purpose but needed proof.

During his trip to Niger, Wilson actually interviewed the former prime
minister of Niger, Ibrahim Assane Mayaki. Mayaki told Wilson that in June of
1999, an Iraqi delegation expressed interest in 'expanding commercial
relations' for the purposes of purchasing yellowcake.

Wilson chose to overlook Mayaki's remarks and reported to the CIA that there
was no evidence of Hussein wanting to purchase yellowcake from Niger.

However, with British intelligence insisting the claim was true, President
Bush used that same claim in his State of the Union address in January of
2003.

Outraged by Bush's insistence that the claim was true, Wilson wrote an op-ed
in the New York Times in the summer of 2003 slamming Bush.

Wilson did this in spite of the fact that Mayaki said Saddam did try to buy
the yellowcake from Niger. The Senate Select Committee on Intelligence
disagreed with Wilson and supported Mayaki's claim. This meant nothing to
Wilson who was opposed to the Iraq war and thus had ulterior motives in
covering up the prime minister's statements.

It was a simple tactic really. If the far-left and their friends in the
media could prove Bush lied about Hussein wanting to purchase yellowcake
from Niger, it would undermine President Bush's credibility and give them
more cause for asking what other lies he may have told.

Yet, the real lie came from Wilson, who interpreted his own meaning from the
prime minister's statements and concluded all by himself that the claim of
Saddam attempting to purchase yellowcake was 'unequivocally wrong.'
Curiously, the CIA sat on this information and did not inform the CIA
Director, who sided with Bush on the yellowcake claim. This was made public
in a bipartisan Senate Intelligence Committee report in July 2004.

Valerie Plame also engaged in her own lie campaign by spreading the notion
that the Bush administration outed her as a CIA agent. Never mind that it
was Richard Armitage -- no friend of the Bush administration -- who leaked
Plame's identity to the press. Never mind that Plame had not been in the
field as a CIA agent in some six years.

The truth is, due to their opposition to the war, Joe Wilson, Valerie Plame,
the mainstream media and their left-wing friends on the blogosphere engaged
in a propaganda campaign to undermine the Bush administration. Now that
Saddam's uranium has been made public and is no longer a threat to the
world, do you think these aforementioned parties will apologize and admit
they were wrong? Don't count on it. The rest of the American people should
hear the truth about Saddam's uranium. It is up to you and me to inform them
every chance we get.



Just a couple quick things to think about. Remember that Big Gov't is like a large tree. That makes you the avg person a mushroom.......you are kept in the dark and fed [email protected]#T, but you grow. Will we ever really know what the truth is? Maybe my kids might one day.
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Old 10-12-2008, 11:40 AM
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Re: Our future....????

Whew... I hope Naomi Wolf is wrong! According to her, there probably wont be another election...

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Old 10-12-2008, 12:01 PM
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Re: Our future....????

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Whew... I hope Naomi Wolf is wrong! According to her, there probably wont be another election...
Man I know, its absolutely chilling. There are a lot of sites on the web, so called conspiracy theory websites, that have mentioned many of the things she did in that interview. What they've been unable to do is link them so thoroughly and really draw the "big picture" like she did.

You have to think that she's either a complete lunatic, or on to something huge here. And watching her, listening to her speak, one gets the impression that she is definitely not crazy. leaving the alternative that she is really onto something big that has dire consequences for all of us. I am going to go buy her book today.
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Old 10-12-2008, 12:17 PM
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Re: Our future....????

Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetpea View Post
2. I'm really not sure about this one........it really needs to be checked out.

*This has been flying under the radar. The MSNBC article a I pasted the TorF version 1 below. IF event is factual. I have a renewed respect for President Bush. He has taken the heat
of being called a liar and a war monger for 5 years while he kept his
silence to protect the people of the world. This is truly a display of
selfless honor.*

On July 5, 2008, the Associated Press (AP) released a story titled: Secret
U.S. mission hauls uranium from Iraq. The opening paragraph is as follows:

The last major remnant of Saddam Hussein's nuclear program a huge stockpile
of concentrated natural uranium reached a Canadian port Saturday to complete
a secret U.S. operation that included a two week airlift from Baghdad and a
ship voyage crossing two oceans.

See anything wrong with this picture? We have been hearing from the far-left
for more than five years how, Bush lied. Somehow, that slogan loses its
credibility now that 550 metric tons of Saddam's yellowcake, used for
nuclear weapon enrichment, has been discovered and shipped to Canada for its
new use as nuclear energy.

It appears that American troops found the 550 metric tons of uranium in 2003
after invading Iraq. They had to sit on this information and the uranium
itself, for fear of terrorists attempting to steal it. It was guarded and
kept safe by our military in a 23,000-acre site with large sand beams
surrounding the site.

Just a couple quick things to think about. Remember that Big Gov't is like a large tree. That makes you the avg person a mushroom.......you are kept in the dark and fed [email protected]#T, but you grow. Will we ever really know what the truth is? Maybe my kids might one day.
Everything I have found suggests that the YellowCake was not weapons grade and was not only known about since the first Gulf War, but documented and controlled. This is not new information, and certainly not a viable explanation or motivation that can justify the current war in Iraq.

http://www.philly.com/inquirer/world...to_Canada.html ( original article reposted after it hit the wire - read the last paragraph)

The reason this isn't a big story, is because, well it just isn't a big story. The Uranium is not weapons grade, was known about, documented, and contained since the first Gulf war.

I absolutely agree with your last paragraph. The depths of deceit created by both political parties is likely staggering and unfathomable. You and I, as the worker bees, see only the parts the government wants us to see. The occasional "slip-up" or whistleblower event are often the only clear window through which we see their true nature.

Scott
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Old 10-12-2008, 12:49 PM
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Re: Our future....????

Come
Help
A
Nobody
Get
Elected
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Old 10-12-2008, 02:01 PM
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Re: Our future....????

Quote:
Originally Posted by sukhoi26mx View Post
Everything I have found suggests that the YellowCake was not weapons grade and was not only known about since the first Gulf War, but documented and controlled. This is not new information, and certainly not a viable explanation or motivation that can justify the current war in Iraq.

http://www.philly.com/inquirer/world...to_Canada.html ( original article reposted after it hit the wire - read the last paragraph)

The reason this isn't a big story, is because, well it just isn't a big story. The Uranium is not weapons grade, was known about, documented, and contained since the first Gulf war.

I absolutely agree with your last paragraph. The depths of deceit created by both political parties is likely staggering and unfathomable. You and I, as the worker bees, see only the parts the government wants us to see. The occasional "slip-up" or whistleblower event are often the only clear window through which we see their true nature.

Scott


Kinda what I found so far as well. Still, having any type of material that could be used for powering a nuke plant when you don't have one......begs the questions.......Why? And what else where they trying to get?
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Old 10-12-2008, 02:54 PM
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Re: Our future....????

Here's one for discussion. I know I'm tired of hearing the dems blaming Bush and the republicans for this mess. Read more....

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=s109-190
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Old 10-12-2008, 04:07 PM
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Re: Our future....????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Lewis View Post
Here's one for discussion. I know I'm tired of hearing the dems blaming Bush and the republicans for this mess. Read more....

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=s109-190
Based on the sources I can find, McCain signed onto the bill a year and a half after it was written, and after it had either died in comittee or left comittee but unacted on. Rather late to the party, I'd say. He also didn't sign on to the follow-on legislation authored by Hagel (S.1100) for some reason.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/9...626/427/606732

Also, the article you attached was an op-ed piece written by McCain's advisor. Lend whatever credence you deem suitable to that, but there is plenty of dissent on the positive impact that S.109 or H.R. 1461 would have made that could have avoided the current crisis, and on McCain's "involvement" in it. Again, it wasn't any one action, any one person, or any one party that either caused or allowed the current crisis.

http://www.aei.org/publications/pubI...pub_detail.asp - H.R. 1461 analysis

Scott
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