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Old 08-13-2017, 08:58 PM
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FLYEMBIG
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Originally Posted by dhal22 View Post
Still have never seen a starting stick at my 350 member club. Everybody just starts by bare hand or with a glove.

I tell you what, if there was no risk in my 170cc engine from doing seriuos damage to my hand I also would start mine bare handed. But since no one can tell me there is no risk in it*...I will use the RS every time.
The fact that you state that some of the 350 members use a glove backs up the fact that there IS risk of serious damage.
To each their own my friend. I personally find it not just safer but easier to use the RCS.

* Except for the guy that says there isnt any danger because all you need to do is not put your hand in a spinning prop!

To each their own my friend...I dont push it,...I offer it!

Richard
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Old 08-13-2017, 09:07 PM
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FLYEMBIG
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Originally Posted by Jason T View Post
I had same problem with my rcs. Worked fine on my 35, but the 100 not a chance, broke the trailing edge off two wood props, so back to the paint roller which has never damaged my props. The thing with putting props at 11, is that if someone is starting your plane say at a competition etc, then using your hand/glove ends up being more dangerous because you cant flip up and away at 11 o clock. The guys that tried mine at our club also didnt like it. They sure as hell werent about to move the props on there imac planes. One guy told me straight out, he wasnt putting it near his 200+ dollar 3 blade cf prop. His choice i guess, but after breaking two of my own wood props its not going near my cf props either.


I have a 3 blade $350.00 prop that I start all day with the RCS with zero damage. If you are breaking the trailing edge off a prop with the RCS then you are not rolling the Stick down the length of the prop and off the tip of the prop...just logic here.
I have never damaged a prop with a RCS...Have damaged props with paint rollers. The other options are an electric starter...which I use on one of my engines that just dosnt want to start by hand...and starting by hand...for me thats not an option. if it is with others then have-at-it.l Stay safe and have fun.

Richard
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:10 PM
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I will definitely update when I get a chance to run it again at 11:00. Again, I'm planning for the RCS to be my backup for the electric starter, so I need to figure out what I'm mechanically doing wrong. And yes, the surgery was on my right prop-flipping shoulder. I had a 98% tear and (4) anchors. The bicep tendon still gets sore just from shifting when I drive my manual transmission Xterra (not my daily driver) if I take a long drive. Prop flipping is a bigger strain than shifting.

For my G23, there is no bolt pattern so it's easy to change. For my 30, 35 and 50cc engines with 4-bolt patterns I might be a challenge setting the prop to 11:00 unless I happened to drill it originally at 2:00.

It's brutal weather in South Florida this time of year, and I don't fly often unless I am up and out really early in the morning on the weekend. So, probably won't get a chance to update for a little while.

Again, I don't fault the RCS, it just didn't work for me the first time, and that's why I posted. To see what I might be doing wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RICHMATH View Post
It is a total let down for me to hear this from you!... We gotta figure out what is not happening here!
I had four...FOUR rotator cuff surgeries (one right after the other) on the same shoulder in two years. I know your pain!! Fortunately they were all on my left shoulder! However, my flipping shoulder is not much better.
When I tune my DLE-170, I will start it at least 30 times with the RCS and every time when I am finished I look at the RCS and say (just like I say in the video)..."This thing really works!" Without the RCS my shoulder would not take that.
I have a friend that tried out one of the first Sticks for me...so I could see how it worked with others. For some reason he just could not get a good flip on the prop. He is your normal guy that does all the normal guy stuff with hand tools but for some reason he just didnt have the action???
Now I do not think I am any more gifted then anyone else but I have never had any problems with manual dextarity...for me the prop flipping with the RCS just came as easy as anything...???
I (as stated in the video) have always set my props at the 11:00 o'clock position. I tried it at 1:00 o'clock and it just really feels wrong to me.
Please try this again with your prop at the 11 position. It sounds like you are doing everything else right. I have had others write me and tell me the same thing and after they went to the 11 position wrote back and said ..."problem solved!"
My friend, if the RCS was not everything I say and everything you read from other pilots I guarantee you I would have discontinued them long time ago and went back into retirement! Lets give this another try.
Give the 11:00 o;clock a try and let me know how that works,...please!

Thanks
Richard
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Old 08-13-2017, 10:19 PM
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FLYEMBIG
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Originally Posted by RCAddiction View Post
I will definitely update when I get a chance to run it again at 11:00. Again, I'm planning for the RCS to be my backup for the electric starter, so I need to figure out what I'm mechanically doing wrong. And yes, the surgery was on my right prop-flipping shoulder. I had a 98% tear and (4) anchors. The bicep tendon still gets sore just from shifting when I drive my manual transmission Xterra (not my daily driver) if I take a long drive. Prop flipping is a bigger strain than shifting.

For my G23, there is no bolt pattern so it's easy to change. For my 30, 35 and 50cc engines with 4-bolt patterns I might be a challenge setting the prop to 11:00 unless I happened to drill it originally at 2:00.

It's brutal weather in South Florida this time of year, and I don't fly often unless I am up and out really early in the morning on the weekend. So, probably won't get a chance to update for a little while.

Again, I don't fault the RCS, it just didn't work for me the first time, and that's why I posted. To see what I might be doing wrong.
I understand. I would like to see you get it worked out to the point where you are as pleased with it as I am, and anything I can do to help I will do.
Keep me updated please.
Richard
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Old 08-14-2017, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by RCAddiction View Post
On the 2nd flight, I still could not get whatever wrist-flipping/snapping thing I'm supposed to do with the RCS to properly accelerate the prop. My shoulder started to get annoyed at me. I had the RCS touching the prop at the 1/3 distance from the tip, prop clocked at 1 o'clock coming up on compression. In frustration, I used my leather glove and it started immediately on the 1st flip.

It was not working for me and certainly was not less stress on my shoulder. I'm clearly doing something wrong since everyone else is thrilled with their RCS.
I think there's two keys to getting an efficient stroke with the RCS. One, it's got to go straight down the blade. If it doesn't, you're losing some of the force because of the angle, and you're scraping the prop and the stick. Two, I try to accentuate a whipping motion with the shoulder. I think that's just a lot more natural and instinctive with your hand right on the blade. Compared to a hand flip, your wrist is turned and bent, and you're losing leverage at the end of the stick. I focus on leading the motion with the shoulder, not the wrist, and whipping the elbow and wrist as they trail. I can imagine though that your shoulder may just not be able to handle the loss of leverage with a stick.
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Old 08-14-2017, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Jason T View Post
I had same problem with my rcs. Worked fine on my 35, but the 100 not a chance, broke the trailing edge off two wood props, so back to the paint roller which has never damaged my props.
You're sliding off the prop with an arc swing and scraping the prop as you slide off. I thought I'd gotten a grip on that after using it for a little while. This weekend though I noticed I was really scraping the prop a lot if I wasn't paying attention. I had to check my CF prop a few times because it sounded pretty bad. I think what's happened is that as the stick has worn, it's not slick like it was when it was new. It's rough now, and if it slides off to the side as compared to rolling straight off, it's going to scrape the prop pretty good and it's going to scrape up the stick pretty good too. It's not causing any damage to my CF props.

When it was new and slick, I don't think I was noticing that as much. Now I've got to redouble my concentration to get a nice straight swing down the prop every time. The same thing is happening with the paint roller, it may just be sliding off with less scraping. You're losing a lot of efficiency by swinging at an angle to the prop though, so getting the swing right is the solution to the problem whether it's your hand or any other stick.
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Old 08-14-2017, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by dldeuce View Post
You're sliding off the prop with an arc swing and scraping the prop as you slide off. I thought I'd gotten a grip on that after using it for a little while. This weekend though I noticed I was really scraping the prop a lot if I wasn't paying attention. I had to check my CF prop a few times because it sounded pretty bad. I think what's happened is that as the stick has worn, it's not slick like it was when it was new. It's rough now, and if it slides off to the side as compared to rolling straight off, it's going to scrape the prop pretty good and it's going to scrape up the stick pretty good too. It's not causing any damage to my CF props.

When it was new and slick, I don't think I was noticing that as much. Now I've got to redouble my concentration to get a nice straight swing down the prop every time. The same thing is happening with the paint roller, it may just be sliding off with less scraping. You're losing a lot of efficiency by swinging at an angle to the prop though, so getting the swing right is the solution to the problem whether it's your hand or any other stick.
I hear ya, and agree it is my technique. its just to me if i have to worry about breaking a wood prop every time i don't do it 100% correctly, then im sticking with the paint roller. I Broke two $65.00 wood props (again my technique) and it really ruined my day.
Never broke a prop on a paint roller no matter how crappy my arm movement is... lol
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Old 08-14-2017, 04:40 PM
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FLYEMBIG
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dldeuce View Post
You're sliding off the prop with an arc swing and scraping the prop as you slide off. I thought I'd gotten a grip on that after using it for a little while. This weekend though I noticed I was really scraping the prop a lot if I wasn't paying attention. I had to check my CF prop a few times because it sounded pretty bad. I think what's happened is that as the stick has worn, it's not slick like it was when it was new. It's rough now, and if it slides off to the side as compared to rolling straight off, it's going to scrape the prop pretty good and it's going to scrape up the stick pretty good too. It's not causing any damage to my CF props.

When it was new and slick, I don't think I was noticing that as much. Now I've got to redouble my concentration to get a nice straight swing down the prop every time. The same thing is happening with the paint roller, it may just be sliding off with less scraping. You're losing a lot of efficiency by swinging at an angle to the prop though, so getting the swing right is the solution to the problem whether it's your hand or any other stick.

Thanks for the post Bro!..
I lub the rollers just before I send them out and check to make sure they roll nice and free. On the instructions it tells you that when the roller starts to loose the nice rolling action you can put a few drops of lube (silicone, teflon lubricating) in the small hole inside the roller. Look down the end of the roller with a flashlight...look for the red paint and you will see a small hole about an inch in from the plug. Put a few drops of lube in the hole and it should spin free again. I use a syringe but if you dont have one you can use a straw or whatevery. The roller should always roll nice and smooth. If you cant get it to roll after you lube it then shoot me a PM.

Thanks again for your post.

Richard
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Old 08-14-2017, 10:46 PM
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One other thing to try if you are having some trouble getting all the way down and off the tip of the prop. When you get ready to put the flip to it, take one baby step to your left. You should actually be just short of reaching for it to the right, that way when your hand gets close to the end of the prop you still have lots of arm left and your not hooking it with an arc motion.
Try not to over think this guys, get set up and give it a commanding flip and get it in the sky!


Richard
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Old 08-15-2017, 08:24 AM
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Commanding flip! My Ultimate was at 2oclock, it was 90+ and 100% humidity and I barely got mine started. Problem.....not a commanding flip. That is the one I'm going to try at 11oclock. All my other planes start fine at 1oclock with the RCS.
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Old 08-15-2017, 09:05 AM
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Originally Posted by sweetpea View Post
Commanding flip! My Ultimate was at 2oclock, it was 90+ and 100% humidity and I barely got mine started. Problem.....not a commanding flip. That is the one I'm going to try at 11oclock. All my other planes start fine at 1oclock with the RCS.
Isn't tat a commanding flip in your avatar
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Old 08-15-2017, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by stingray528i View Post
Isn't tat a commanding flip in your avatar

Ha!..Ha!.. good eyes!..

r
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Old 08-15-2017, 09:30 AM
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funny to read from guys who come from big clubs and everyone has their hand in the prop. I did it for years too, and still do it with 120s and smaller with two blade props. But with the large three blade carbon props....not a chance.

I have a neighbor who refuses to wear a bicycle helmet because of what it does to his hair. I doubt that my experiences as a cyclist for many decades and a true believer in the protection afforded by a helmet after a few impacts on the pavement would make any difference. Most recently my brother was cut off by a driver and he wound up with several broken ribs and a scapula in pieces. His brain, however, was just fine. Do the smart thing guys and don't pretend that this is sort some of scare tactic so Rich can make a couple of bucks.
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Old 08-15-2017, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by FGNewbie View Post
funny to read from guys who come from big clubs and everyone has their hand in the prop. I did it for years too, and still do it with 120s and smaller with two blade props. But with the large three blade carbon props....not a chance.

I have a neighbor who refuses to wear a bicycle helmet because of what it does to his hair. I doubt that my experiences as a cyclist for many decades and a true believer in the protection afforded by a helmet after a few impacts on the pavement would make any difference. Most recently my brother was cut off by a driver and he wound up with several broken ribs and a scapula in pieces. His brain, however, was just fine. Do the smart thing guys and don't pretend that this is sort some of scare tactic so Rich can make a couple of bucks.
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Old 08-15-2017, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by stingray528i View Post
Isn't tat a commanding flip in your avatar
That is a SALUTE....not a flip.
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