Originally Posted by wmat7039

I am beginning to come to the conclusion that I stalled the plane (even though I don't see how that could happen with the attitude/speed the aircraft was in on the approach) but indications are leading me in that direction.

My Shockwave looked exactly like your Leonardo when it went in. I had no idea it was that close and tried to tighten up the turn to final just a tiny bit. AJ was standing right next to me and almost yelled "don't pull back!" before it quit flying, but it was too late. He saw it coming, I didn't.

I used to fly a regular pattern like a full scale with two turns from downwind to final. After watching a bunch of jet guys land, they all do a 180 degree constant rate turn from downwind to final. That's how I do it now, lots less chance of stalling the inside wing without those two 90 degree turns.

Same here, I try to do a 180 descending turn to final on warbirds and jets especially

I think I fly my GS gas planes that way already. I know with my small F-16EDF and my F-4EDF I felt they both felt a little underpowered and I always worried about the final turn being to slow. I probably carry extra speed and less aggressive banking out of fear. It'll be interesting to see what I do when I get my F9F going this summer. So, I take what you guys say to heart (along with my full scale Jet time in the T-38/F-16 I've had when I got to fly the approaches)

The Kingcat I flew in the past (Other People's Plane) was over powered so I never felt like a stall would occur.

Originally Posted by sweetpea

I think I fly my GS gas planes that way already. I know with my small F-16EDF and my F-4EDF I felt they both felt a little underpowered and I always worried about the final turn being to slow. I probably carry extra speed and less aggressive banking out of fear. It'll be interesting to see what I do when I get my F9F going this summer. So, I take what you guys say to heart (along with my full scale Jet time in the T-38/F-16 I've had when I got to fly the approaches)

The Kingcat I flew in the past (Other People's Plane) was over powered so I never felt like a stall would occur.

which F9F do you have? i have a ziroli and i could help with a few tips depending on what you have.

A flurry of activity has taken place in the past days that has put me far forward in moving toward the painting stage. There were also exposures to maiden ground that opened new avenues for doing projects the correct way.

After doing an immense amount of measuring (from everywhere possible), and having been pelted with "you're overthinking it" rebukes I felt it best to head over to my friend (Tony Jacobs) who built my Dalton 300 to "do the deed!" So, I plopped the Leo in his workshop & we spent the next 2 solid days getting as much as possible done. I am 100% positive that I tested his patience on at least 5 occasions.... and somehow, at the end, we still ended up as friends!

Tony double checked all my measurements and centering and then he took his Dremel out!! I was scared crapless at his first cut....but it looked great and I settled down. The ailerons, elevators and rudder horn slots were done and then we looked at the flaps.

The factory in Italy must have issued out Jamaican "151% overproof" rum to the worker who glued in the blocks for the flap horns...as they (both) were quite a bit off and it was impossible to get a straight shot back from the servo if we used the factory blocks. Tony suggested cutting out the leading edge of the flaps and installing our own blocks, but tie the new block to the old one for strength. This was the third out of five times that he had to undergo therapy for my feisty objections. (I don't know how he puts up with me??)

I drove home with a lot on my mind and the next morning, I called 4 persons who have owned Leo's, trying to come to a conclusion with what to do. Two said to just cut slots and fill the area with Aeropoxy..... The other two said that I could consider cutting the front and putting in my own block in the correct place for the horns. I decided to follow Tony's original suggestion and I "sheepishly slinked" back to his workshop to let him know that he was right from the beginning and we should fix it properly.

He did not revel in any "I told you so" response making me feel even worse! The ensuing work to complete both flap hard points and cutting of the slots were done in a much shorter time than I thought it would take. We then moved on to making our own leads for the servos.

I used the PowerBox MAXI wires which has larger leads for the power (+ & -) and slightly smaller wire for the signal. They are also heat resistant. I noticed that the wires that were being replaced (ones going to the rudder/elevator servos) were very brittle but unbroken...even though they were protected by a ceramic heat resistant sleeve all the way back. This was the second area that I ventured into that I had no experience at all (making my own servo leads), and I was very apprehensive. However, the PowerBox crimper tool and servo ends made it easier to make a go of it after watching Martin Pickering's video of crimping. It takes getting used to...so, since Tony had much more experience in building leads, he was the one who crimped, while I attached the ends.

I will go into this in my next post as this one is already lengthy.

Originally Posted by Carruthers43

which F9F do you have? i have a ziroli and i could help with a few tips depending on what you have.

TopRC is what I have.

Originally Posted by wmat7039

A flurry of activity has taken place in the past days that has put me far forward in moving toward the painting stage. There were also exposures to maiden ground that opened new avenues for doing projects the correct way.

After doing an immense amount of measuring (from everywhere possible), and having been pelted with "you're overthinking it" rebukes I felt it best to head over to my friend (Tony Jacobs) who built my Dalton 300 to "do the deed!" So, I plopped the Leo in his workshop & we spent the next 2 solid days getting as much as possible done. I am 100% positive that I tested his patience on at least 5 occasions.... and somehow, at the end, we still ended up as friends!

Tony double checked all my measurements and centering and then he took his Dremel out!! I was scared crapless at his first cut....but it looked great and I settled down. The ailerons, elevators and rudder horn slots were done and then we looked at the flaps.

The factory in Italy must have issued out Jamaican "151% overproof" rum to the worker who glued in the blocks for the flap horns...as they (both) were quite a bit off and it was impossible to get a straight shot back from the servo if we used the factory blocks. Tony suggested cutting out the leading edge of the flaps and installing our own blocks, but tie the new block to the old one for strength. This was the third out of five times that he had to undergo therapy for my feisty objections. (I don't know how he puts up with me??)

I drove home with a lot on my mind and the next morning, I called 4 persons who have owned Leo's, trying to come to a conclusion with what to do. Two said to just cut slots and fill the area with Aeropoxy..... The other two said that I could consider cutting the front and putting in my own block in the correct place for the horns. I decided to follow Tony's original suggestion and I "sheepishly slinked" back to his workshop to let him know that he was right from the beginning and we should fix it properly.

He did not revel in any "I told you so" response making me feel even worse! The ensuing work to complete both flap hard points and cutting of the slots were done in a much shorter time than I thought it would take. We then moved on to making our own leads for the servos.

I used the PowerBox MAXI wires which has larger leads for the power (+ & -) and slightly smaller wire for the signal. They are also heat resistant. I noticed that the wires that were being replaced (ones going to the rudder/elevator servos) were very brittle but unbroken...even though they were protected by a ceramic heat resistant sleeve all the way back. This was the second area that I ventured into that I had no experience at all (making my own servo leads), and I was very apprehensive. However, the PowerBox crimper tool and servo ends made it easier to make a go of it after watching Martin Pickering's video of crimping. It takes getting used to...so, since Tony had much more experience in building leads, he was the one who crimped, while I attached the ends.

I will go into this in my next post as this one is already lengthy.

Leap of Faith! Glad you got experienced help. But now, you are the expert....so pass it on to the next guy needing someone to bring a plane over

Originally Posted by sweetpea

TopRC is what I have.

We have a couple of them at our field, they seem to fly pretty good

As the days go by, more progress brings me closer to painting. We built the servo leads for the rudder, both elevators (approx 7 feet each), ailerons and the flaps all in one afternoon. The really good thing for me, is that there is now no mid-stream connectors going all the way to the back.....they are all one run, so the voltage at the back end will not have any "loss" due to mid-way connectors. For the ailerons/flaps, both were built with leeway for where the PowerBox Mercury will be placed. We also measured from the root rib going out to the ailerons and gave a few inches spare. We did not build the wires for the Electron L/Gears as yet, as we wanted to have them on hand first, to see exactly how those wires will be run. I will soon have those from Greg Alderman.

So, over the weekend, I again ventured into virgin territory. In all the years of aerobatics flying, I have always had complete faith in West Systems epoxy to glue critical areas for my airplanes. There were two distinct drawbacks with West Systems that I have experienced and didn't look forward to again repeating. 1) Since my cans had regulated plungers, I used those when mixing. There was always wastage as the set-up times varied with the size of the container I used in the mixing process. 2) Each time, I experienced sinus stuffiness after using West Systems.

So.... I decided to go with what all the jet jockeys have been using for years as a new adventure, by trying out Locktite's Hysol. Man.... let me tell you......My apprehension was short lived!! Using the applicator "gun" and the short nozzle, I completed installation of all ailerons, rudder and elevators horns in one afternoon. 1) No wastage at all, and no mixing was required as the mixing nozzle takes care of that when applying the glue. 2) My head was not swirling nor did I experience any stuffiness after using the Hysol. Although it has to dry overnight, I just practiced restraint and left them alone. The next day, I finished the flaps. I did not want to disturb the aileron horns while trying to glue the flaps as I would have had to turn the wings over for access to the flap horns from above. I am happy to say that I am completely satisfied with how they all went together. This glue is "space shuttle" grade and has a phenomenal shear strength.

On another note...... Archie Stafford (now the President of NSRCA) has built a new permanent website for F3S and Jet Aerobatics in the USA. Because of this, I have taken down my website and we will be using this one from here on out. JET AEROBATICS.

On this site, registration for the upcoming NATS is now open and we have already had several entries.... including some surprising names in the industry!! If you are planning on attending, please try to register soon.

Hysol is the shizz Wayne, you just have to be careful on how much you use, as it can add weight very quick.

Already registered Wayne!

Wait until you try the Hysol E20-HP! If you need a fix at an event, it’s cure time is much faster than 9462.

Originally Posted by wmat7039

So.... I decided to go with what all the jet jockeys have been using for years as a new adventure, by trying out Locktite's Hysol. Man.... let me tell you......My apprehension was short lived!! Using the applicator "gun" and the short nozzle, I completed installation of all ailerons, rudder and elevators horns in one afternoon. 1) No wastage at all, and no mixing was required as the mixing nozzle takes care of that when applying the glue. 2) My head was not swirling nor did I experience any stuffiness after using the Hysol. Although it has to dry overnight, I just practiced restraint and left them alone. The next day, I finished the flaps. I did not want to disturb the aileron horns while trying to glue the flaps as I would have had to turn the wings over for access to the flap horns from above. I am happy to say that I am completely satisfied with how they all went together. This glue is "space shuttle" grade and has a phenomenal shear strength.

You can play around with the 9462 at about eight hours, overnight and for all intents and purposes it's set, but full cure takes three days at 72 degrees.

For that reason, you ought to keep some E20-HP around for the reason rcflying53 expressed.

You can also cut down the waste and cost of the nozzles by squirting the glue into a mixing cup w/o the nozzle and mixing with a stick. This works really good if you don't need much, like if you're only gluing one horn in or making a repair. Also I second the use E20-HP over the 9462, E20 is all I use now.

Originally Posted by rcflying53

Already registered Wayne!

Wait until you try the Hysol E20-HP! If you need a fix at an event, it’s cure time is much faster than 9462.

Thanks Adam. In my exuberance, I ordered 3 tubes of the 9462 and stored the other 2 in the refrigerator. They expire in 2021. If I had known about the E20, I would have gone with that instead.

It’s all fine though. Everything in time.

Originally Posted by rcmigpilot

You can also cut down the waste and cost of the nozzles by squirting the glue into a mixing cup w/o the nozzle and mixing with a stick. This works really good if you don't need much, like if you're only gluing one horn in or making a repair. Also I second the use E20-HP over the 9462, E20 is all I use now.

Thanks for the input with the nozzles. I do have some smaller gluing jobs that will come up when I get back the painted Leo. Hope to meet up with you guys sometime after I get back in the air.
W