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Old 09-21-2009, 09:32 PM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Wayne, you never work.....god love you though.....no wonder you like it.....but, I agree with Jeff Williams. Pretty tough on guys with real jobs and my son and I plan on making a bunch more contests next summer. Not that anybody cares what I think anyway. I do like the fact that Ric is always trying to improve his contest. Good job Ric.
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Old 09-21-2009, 09:52 PM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Quote:
Originally Posted by ricmussman View Post
What do you think?
Ric
-1

Tim
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Old 09-21-2009, 10:01 PM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Sounds good Ric!
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Old 09-21-2009, 10:06 PM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

We are having a 3 day contest for our regional finals this year in the Northeast as a last "hoorah" to the end of the season. It has been well recieved by the guys in the NE. I think it will be nice to have multiple unknowns as well!
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Old 09-22-2009, 04:19 AM
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Learn how to work Kid.
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

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Originally Posted by Craven View Post
Wayne, you never work......
I am at work right now.
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Old 09-22-2009, 04:57 AM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

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Originally Posted by ken6881 View Post
I like it more flying is more fun. The only thing is I personaly have school year round so i guess skipping one day of school isn't too bad(ie deffantly a good idea). Defanatly would be interesting to see it work out.

tell your mom that
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Old 09-22-2009, 05:13 AM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

I grew up in Xenia and still have family there that I hardly ever get to see. Hummmm.....what a great excuse to come visit the Buckeye! I like your schedule too! Me thinks I'll write this one down!
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Old 09-22-2009, 06:20 AM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

I do like the idea of flying 2 unknowns. Maybe I am odd, but unknowns are my favorite part of the contest. There is some good debate here.
Jeff
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Old 09-22-2009, 08:33 AM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Ric,
I am all for the 3 day contest. It would be great practice for the Nats. The 4 days in a row last year really took its toll on us.

You got me thinking about this and if a lot of pilots can't make it how about this !

Make friday a UNKNOWN contest just for practice for those who can make friday.

11:30 pilots meeting hand out first unknown
12:00 first round all classes, pilot lands hand him his next unknown
and so on till we get 4 or 5 rounds in.
If not a lot show we can run 1 flight line and rotate judges quickly
and redraw flight order each round.

For the unknowns I am sure we can come up with some old unknowns and knowns for all upper classes.

For basic use past known basic seqences. I think they would even enjoy doing this.

Just something to think about while you are trying to see how many pilots will come to do friday.
Because if all saturday and sunday pilots can't make friday the ones that can would have their own contest on friday. I would hate to see some back out on your normal contest because they could not make it on friday to do a 3 day contest.

Mike K.
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Old 09-22-2009, 09:31 AM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Mike that is a really good idea!
What a challenge!

Don
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Old 09-22-2009, 10:49 AM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Cool Mike!

Unknown Friday

Your idea for Basic we tried a few times, mix up the order of the Known, write a new one. A huge success. We have been careful to stress to the pilots that it is not mandatory and it does not count towards the contest in any way, don't risk the aircraft if you are uncomfortable. They had an absolute blast with it. A great way for them to get a little taste of the dynamics of an Unknown, even the little things like "Ok guys don't forget you only fly the sequence once". New concept to many.

We also offered use your regular caller or we can put a "top" pilot beside you in case you get in trouble.

All this in support of the "Basic is our future" theme that others have referred to and perhaps could help some pilots make the transition to Sportsman more easily.

Rick
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Old 09-22-2009, 11:25 AM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigExtra260 View Post
I would hate to see some back out on your normal contest because they could not make it on friday to do a 3 day contest.

Mike K.
I totally agree with this Mike. I like your ideas listed above.

Here is the concern I have with a 3-day event. With the Hamilton event taking place so early in the season I could see additional CD's also going to a 3-day contest for their event. If the Hamilton event is successful (and I see no reason why it wouldn't be) then it sets a precedence for other events in the NC region. There are many contests in the NC that could easily support (due to the number of pilots) a 3-day event.

Here are contests in the NC that had 35 + pilots this year:

- Don Carmichael Memorial
- Columbus IMAC Challenge
- Hamilton Hawks IMAC Challenge
- Greater Cinncinnati IMAC Challenge
- Crossroads IMAC
- Regional Finals

My concern is that for those of us that normally work Fridays and yes even Saturdays we are looking at burning A LOT more vacaction (and I'm sure sick days) should the 3-day Hamilton venue have a roll over effect at other events. Don't get me wrong I'd like to fly more at these events as well but I'm sure I would have to be a lot more selective on what events to attend due to having to burn the extra time off of work in order to attend it. The other consideration is that there are other major events during the year that will require substantial vacation time should I (or others) decided to attend such as the NATS, Clover Creek, and perhaps TAS.

I realize that many people that attend these events have different work schedules, vacation accural rates, may be retired, etc., etc., etc. but there are those of use that are just "common folk" that attend because these events happen on the weekend (Saturday/Sunday). If the concerns is getting more rounds in during a contest then why don't we fly more rounds on Sunday? Sure I know people would like to leave early on Sunday to get home but what difference is staying and flying 2 more rounds on Sunday than starting an event on a Friday?? Especially those of us with families? I was to several events this year where we could have easily flown one possibly two additional rounds on Sunday.

I hope this does not come off as a negative message but I know Rick would want to hear it (good or bad) as this is my concern. Would I attend the Hamilton event if it were a 3-day event? Sure, absolutely. The concern comes on what other CD's might do with their events.

Just a thought.

Tim
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Old 09-22-2009, 12:59 PM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Tim - thanks for speaking up on this. I agree with you.

Eventhough Hamilton is a "local" contest for me and I normally show up Friday anyway, I feel it sets a bad precedence for other contests. There are some contests that I do not attend because they are three plus days (i.e. Clover Creek). The Nats requires a week vacation. Sometimes I take the time off for the Nats and sometimes I choose to use that time for other trips. If the Nats was held on a weekend +2 days, I would go every year. If a lot of contests went to the three day format, it would GREATLY limit the number of participants at each contest.

I am not sure what is gained by having three days vs two except it makes it harder to take the time off. Plus - the national committee only writes one set of unknowns for a weekend. This would be an added burden of creating additional unknowns.

So - my vote - for what little it counts - would be to keep contests to two days.

Keith
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Old 09-22-2009, 01:17 PM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

I'm with Keith on that one.

Regular 3 day contests push the limits of many peoples free time.

I like the contests but if it starts to be a trend that you have to dedicate the better part of a week to do one it's getting a bit much.

That might be the best part of Mike's idea. If you run the Unknown Friday as a separate little contest then people can pick 2 or 3 days as life and it's commitments permit.
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Old 09-22-2009, 01:49 PM
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Re: 2010 Hamilton IMAC **Proposal**

Sun.flyer, you make a nice reply. I certainly do not see it as a negative to voice your concerns (or a racist for that matter).
I do like the idea of flying unknowns on a sorta for fun basis on Friday.
OK, I have thought about this many times and now is the time to say it. If you want to fly more then the best way to do it and not go to a 3 day event is to get started earlier. As a CD I strive to start no later than 9am, why is this? Because guys will not get up to sign in, they want a quick practice flight or they show up at start time further delaying things. As a CD I rely on the sign in sheet to build flying lines, stations, judges etc. Until everyone is signed in we have a hard time doing that. I suggest that we post all contests on the IMAC site with a hard sign in and start time. If you are not there at that time we will start flying w/o you, yes you could still get in the contest but it may cause you to miss your first round. (Yes, I am assuming local weather, noise restrictions or other site things may prohibit this, but those places that can do this it is an easy way to get more rounds.) Also, contestants need to do the best job they can at knowing their turn to fly or judge, in other words be ready such that the CD does not have to chase you down and remind you. Start and launch your plane as the preceding contestant exits the box, is lining up to land or during the last few maneuvers of the sequence, each contest can handle this individually but it helps to get in the air quickly.
Again, not trying to stir or incite anyone just my thoughts as a contestant and CD.
Jeff Williams
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